Pre-Cup Needed

[19887.3IDI]

Does anyone have a pre-cup exactly the same as this one that would be willing to sell to me? I only need one to match the other 7 because there is one that is different and causing my engine to shake.

 

[ToughOldFord]

Riotwarrior mentioned in this thread that he has some he could sell.

 

[riotwarrior]

The one that is different from the other 7 has 88 cast into it as well but the hole is shaped different and I cant find anything else wrong with this engine to cause it to shake.

...

I'll do this in the open, I've looked close at your cup and several images of mine. I'll be adding some more images to the other thread tomorrow.

What makes you think the PRECUP is the issue?

What do you mean shake?

First, introduce yourself here, and lets see if we can determine what's going on before throwing parts at this.

Have the injectors been pop tested? What injectors are they? How old? How old is IP?

There are a few things that can cause an issue.

What is the engine in? If it is a truck is the #1 cylinders injector line on the factory timing adapter still? If not this could affect timing of one cylinder...

Just too many things to learn, before I pop one precup.

Fee free to browse the pics tomorrow in that thread, there are two more sets of heads photographed in detail.

Al

 

[19887.3IDI]

Here is a thread that I have going over at FTE that should answer all your questions and more.
http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1300299-shaking-engine.html

 

[riotwarrior]

, Posted there too rofl...

I'm not 100% sold on the precup idea, however it could be. Wait for pics tomorrow...hopefully others may chime in.

Wonder if you got the good cam gear?

Also GET IT TIMED properly!

 

[icanfixall]

Well you have posted twice that the pump and injectors are fine. you had the shop that sold them to you check them. And they found it fine.... Sorry but thats what a seller shop is going to tell you. Please tell us what shop you are using for the injectors and injection pump. Because I don't know you I need to ask some questions. What makes you feel the injectors are new when you got them. Also why are you not having the engine timed correctly. And my last question is about the pump. By pressing in on the plunger you definitely will feel the engine run differently. Everyone is trying to help you on both forums and not trying to say your not smart. But simple questions have to be asked to help. Years ago I was helping a member with timing of his engine. Seems he was getting a advance of 270 degrees and he could not figure out what was wrong. So I asked a very simple question about what cylinder he connected the pulse timing adapter too. Is it on number one cylinder.. His answer was yes, its on number one. So I asked what side of the engine is number one cylinder. He told me it was on the drivers side... Well that was his timing issue. He was on number 2 cylinder and did not know it. Sadly our intake manifolds have each cylinder number cast right into them near the 2 bolts that holds the intake to each head cylinder point. Usually we need to clean off lots of dirt to see it. Also the timing firing order is found on the passenger side of the intake air horn. You have done plenty of tear down work checking this out. Its my feelings your injection pump is the problem. Might also be injectors too but I have only your words telling me they are new. Our injection pumps have a delivery valve in them. If that goes bad and they do sometimes your idle will shake but just off idle it runs smooth. I will do a search to find a great utube video showing this pump cut down and how it works. It explains the delivery valve proper operation very well.

 

[19887.3IDI]

The shop I got the pump from was USDieselParts.com. When I push the plunger in on the side of the pump the engine does sound different and smokes blue but it doesn't change the shaking it might run a little rougher too but it still has the same shake along with it. I got the injectors from TheDieselStore.com they are brand new Delphi BB codes I can tell they are new because the tip has a machined surface and it doesn't look like they have been dissembled, cleaned up and put back togather. I also got a set of brand new stanadyne D codes off eBay. I also got a used pump off eBay with 40,000 miles on it and I put that in and it still ran the exact same. I have checked the cam and injection pump gears to make sure they are lined up correctly and they are. So with 3 different pumps and adjusting the timing to several different positions without it even changing the shake it makes me think that the problem is not the pump or timing. When I adjusting I could tell I was pretty close because when it was advanced it got louder and when was retarted it was quieter and if I went to far either way it would start to run rough but the shake would still be there. It looks to me that it is only one cylinder causing this. I even bought a cheep pop tester so I could test my own injectors and over the last 4 years I have tried all kinds of different things (like pop pressure, and different spray patterns) and nothing has effected the shake. So I moved away from the fuel system and took the heads off because I was thinking valves since it has kind of a slight chuff to it but the valves are fine (hardly any play and I poured fuel into the exhaust and intake ports and let it sit for a while and they didn't leak at all). So I popped all the pre-cups out and found one odd ball one which to me makes sense because its the only one and there is only one cylinder causing the shaking. I would definitely like to get a matching pre-cup to swap with the different one before I put it back together.

 

[icanfixall]

Ok.. I understand what your explaining better. Although it difficult to think a precup could or would cause this ruff idle. It may well be the only reason. Seems like you have checked or replaced every other part. I suppose a cup with a different throat in it could create a different flame front and pressure pulse to the crank but its a stretch to believe this too. Heres hoping you can find the correct precup.

 

[icanfixall]

Here is the DB2 pump cut away video... Its very interesting information well done...
http://www.oilburners.net/forums/sh...g-U-Tube-Video&highlight=injection+pump+video

 

[19887.3IDI]

Ya I know its a stretch but its the only thing I can find that is different from the other cylinders in the heads and the block. Its not just a rough idle it shakes all the way up to about 2,000 rpm than after that it starts to smooth out a little but its still kind of rough at higher rpm as well. Sorry I didn't mention that. The pre-cups that Al has look to be the same as the other 7 that I have so hopefully he will sell me one.

 

[riotwarrior]

Pick one cup out of the A-H 2 series of pics...the last set I've posted this AM I've got one out of that set of heads I'm keeping so I'm ending up with not a full set.

I've got at least two more sets of heads to look at yet mind you. One set on a running engine, one set on a core.

As mentioned I'm keeping ONE set for myself and it WILL BE the cream of the crop, inspected extremely close with 30x scope!

If I had Zyglow I'd do that..ROFL but I don't...

Al

 

[19887.3IDI]

Ill take A2 if that's ok with you.

 

[riotwarrior]

Ill take A2 if that's ok with you.

That is fine, PM me your address and paypal info, I'll pop it out and get it in a flat rate box, let you know what it fits and cost, I sell sets at $15 Each one will be $20 + shipping + 10.75 border crossing fee...ugh

Al

 

[JosieGallows]

I found this completely by accident. http://www.ebay.com/itm/190781686543

 

[ToughOldFord]

Even if it is a stretch, obviously there's be no point in putting it all back together without matching the one.

It'll be interesting to see what the end result is.