Performance questions- 1992 with ATS Turbo

[reklund]

Hey guys-

My buddy at work is killing me. He's got a 2001 CTD, with a 4" exhaust and a hypermax programmer, and it just KILLS my old IDI. I don't expect my old truck to run with the new ones, but something's gotta give!

A little background: I bought my truck in 2004 with 72000 miles on it. It was babied by a little old man for years, and never saw much action. I purchased it because it was so clean and well-cared for. The truck ran fine, but was a ***** to start when cold. 8 new Beru's and all was good. I hooked up my trailer for the first time, loaded with my Toyota rockcrawler, and was sorely disappointed in the performance from my old Ford. I immediately started researching turbo systems. Fast forward to Sept. 2005. I scored a used ATS kit on ebay, bought a 4" MBRP exhaust, and set out to solve my "slow truck" issues. The addition of the turbo and the exhaust definitely helped my performance, but it still just doesn't have the 'oomph' it should, in my opinion.

I now have 86000 miles on the truck, and it seems to run fine. I'm beginning to wonder about the IP and Injectors, as they're original, aside from turning the pump up as per the ATS instructions. Could the IP have "deteriorated" over the years? Do they just go out all at once? I plan to replace with Ken's upgraded IP and stage 1 injectors, but only if I'll see the benefit with my old ATS setup. It doesn't seem to generate enought boost to really need an upgraded fuel system:

I'm only running 5-6 psi max boost on my non-wastegated ATS system. Is that about right? There's no abnormal wear or play in the Turbo, so I'm assuming it's OK. Should it run more boost than that, even at my 5200' altitude? I've got the 3" DP mated to my 4" MBRP Exhaust, so flow isn't an issue.

EGT's will go up to 1150 (Where I let off) when pulling the trailer up a long grade, but normally hover at 700-900 cruising at 65-70 with the trailer.

Am I worrying about nothing? Is this as good as it gets with the old IDI's? Should I give up and put a CTD engine in my old truck?

Enlighten me, please
Ryan

 

[deanj]

Ip and injectors could be getting old, but what have you done to the air intake? Doing a 'ram air or colw induction ' may help. Screw in the waste gate actuator another 5 turns (2 lbs of boost). Where is your pyro?

 

[reklund]

Intake is the Stock ATS Setup, which pulls from the 'scoop' that mounts over the drivers side battery.

It's a non-wastegates system, so boost is what it is, I presume...

Pyro is in the drivers side exhaust manifold.

Ryan

 

[93turbo_animal]

well since it is non wastegated you need more fuel to make more boost so crank that IP up and yes they do where down when I first got my truck it wouldn't even redline it just ran out of fuel but other wise ran good put new pump on even before turning it up and it was a big improvement

 

[reklund]

My IP is cranked up pretty good...it smokes like a train, but doesn't have much power above 2500 RPM. That's pretty much what prompted my questions about the IP and injectors.

I'm an ASE Master/Toyota Expert tech, but don't have any access to diesel timing equipment. I've not been able to check the timing yet, but I think it's OK...

I know it's possible to install an IP without a timing setup, just to get it running. Any reason NOT to do the install myself, and just pay for timing, rather than have the whole mess installed by a diesel specialist?

Ryan

 

[93turbo_animal]

nope no reason you can't do it I did mine and I had just found TDS back then I think it was Ford diesel or something like that but I knever read any of the post about doing it I just did it and everything came out good when Mel checked the timing for me it was retarded 4 deg if it don't have much rattle to it then it needs advanced a little but hard to do if you have never heard one that you knew was timed right It does sound like your IP is getting wore out sounds just like mine did ran out on the top end

 

[reklund]

Hmmmm.... Guess I'll start saving some fun tickets and give ole' Ken a call. I guess it can't hurt anything, at the least.

How much boost should I expect to run from a non-wastegated ATS system? I've seen it up around 9psi, maybe 10, with the trailer hooked up...

Thanks for all the help!
Ryan

 

[Tristan]

I don't know about ATS, but my old non-wastegated Banks will run up to 12 easy and seems like it would go higher. I try to keep it under 9-10 pounds of boost. Not quite ready to do headgaskets and studs....

 

[TLBREWER]

My IP is cranked up pretty good...it smokes like a train, but doesn't have much power above 2500 RPM. That's pretty much what prompted my questions about the IP and injectors.

I'm an ASE Master/Toyota Expert tech, but don't have any access to diesel timing equipment. I've not been able to check the timing yet, but I think it's OK...

I know it's possible to install an IP without a timing setup, just to get it running. Any reason NOT to do the install myself, and just pay for timing, rather than have the whole mess installed by a diesel specialist?

Ryan

Ryan

Have you been able to talk to your Snap On rep about that GP adapter I need for my MT480? If I can get that, we can check your timing. We'll learn at the same time. As far as IP and injectors. When I did Carla's two months ago, it made a huge difference. Because my timer isn't working, I took it down to Martin at Central Motive Power (Princeton and Comanche). My '92 has the wastegated ATS on it so it may not be a good comparison, but I've noticed a huge decrease in power over the last 100K miles. That being said, mine is still on the original IP and injectors and approaching 250K miles. Needless to say it is getting some new thirst quenchers this summer. :Sly

We need to get together anyway for the photos I was telling you about. PM me with a good weekend for you. I'm busy this weekend and the weekend before the 4th.

Last time we talked you said someone you worked with just picked up an IDI. Any updates to that?

Tom

 

[reklund]

Tristan- I'd expect higher boost numbers down near sea level where you are... up here in the air at 5200', theres less air to compress... I still would hope that my ATS system would push a little more...

Ryan

 

[reklund]

Tom-

I can get you the adaptor you need...I just need to order it, and haven't done it yet. I guess a new IP and injectors are on my list...maybe Ken will give us a deal if we purchase at the same time... It'll be a good time to figure out how to time these damn things...

I'm out of town from tomorrow until the 5th, from the 12th to the 15th, but that's it for June. Looks like I'll be around on the weekends if you want to get together. I'm off on Saturday's this month, so it'll be easier to coordinate schedules.

Jeff at work purchased a 92 IDI, but hasn't done much of anything with it. To my knowledge, it just sits at his house in Rio Rancho, since it's so much cheaper for him to commute in his Honda. I'll rattle his chain next week to get 'er fired up. I know his needs a newer IP and injectors too, so maybe he'll go in on a bit of a NM 'group buy' from Ken.

Hope we can get together soon-
Ryan

 

[TLBREWER]

Tom-

I can get you the adaptor you need...I just need to order it, and haven't done it yet. I guess a new IP and injectors are on my list...maybe Ken will give us a deal if we purchase at the same time... It'll be a good time to figure out how to time these damn things...

I'm out of town from tomorrow until the 5th, from the 12th to the 15th, but that's it for June. Looks like I'll be around on the weekends if you want to get together. I'm off on Saturday's this month, so it'll be easier to coordinate schedules.

Jeff at work purchased a 92 IDI, but hasn't done much of anything with it. To my knowledge, it just sits at his house in Rio Rancho, since it's so much cheaper for him to commute in his Honda. I'll rattle his chain next week to get 'er fired up. I know his needs a newer IP and injectors too, so maybe he'll go in on a bit of a NM 'group buy' from Ken.

Hope we can get together soon-
Ryan

Sounds good. Let me know how much Snap On wants to **** me for on that adapter. I'll call ya in a couple weeks.

Tom

 

[reklund]

Tom-

I'll get it ordered next Wednesday when our Snap-On guy comes.

Anybody else wanna chime in on my boost numbers? Are they about right for my setup, or too low?

Ryan

 

[pafixitman]

Ryan,
I have a wastegated ATS and max is 6.5. (i have not turned up the wastegate...yet...yes, I should have done it before I installed it... )

 

[Diesel JD]

I don't see you hanging with the ISB without some very sick mods to that IDI and even then maybe not. Hopefully you can get a little more boost with a Kens pump, you really ought to be able to. Your current system is probably past its prime. Oh yeah, as a well qualified mech, you'll ahve no problems with a new IP, if you can hook up with Tlbrewer and get the thing timed properly that will be better than by ear, it's 8.5*BTDC with the stock pump @2000RPM and no accessory load. It may be different with a Ken's pump as the whole fuel delivery curve is changed on those things, you'll have to ask him.