Front end needs some TLC

[flathead jack]

i dont know about 4 wheel drive but my 2wheel 1990 had loose bolts that hold the ibeam bracket to the frame one of them was gone.

 

[bignastystacks]

Alright guys I spoke to soon. The tie rode made it alot better but I still feel a wobble up front but it only does it sometimes. I am thinking of overhauling my whole power steering as it is leaking quite bad. Could the leaky PS be causeing a sloppy front end? pump is like 60 gear 100+. It seemed like it only would happen after a hard right or left hand turn. Almost like it wants to keep turning once i straighten out the wheel but my hand fights it but it pulls back, hand fights it but it pulls back ect ect. today I was at a stop waiting to turn left two lane roads so it was tight. I turned but it almost felt like it was sticking to the left then I turn the wheel a bit more and it jolts to the right then goes into the wobble explained above (before the tie rods it was a lot worse.) IDEAS IDEAS IDEAS...I have a 300 mile trip and im towing 20 grand worth of toys in 3 weeks.

 

[Clayton]

Check your rag joint. Mine was completely worn, Caused my truck to wander badly.

 

[flathead jack]

did have the toe in set also did you check the brackets that hold the twin i beams to the frame the bolts were loose mine would go into wild shimmy i would have to stop to get it to quit does your 4x4 have twin i beam

 

[RLDSL]

If the rag joint is good , it sounds an awful lot like that steer axle is rotated under too many degrees. That will make the steering wheel grab when you are turned near the lock on either side. Sometimes just excessive spring wear can cause this to happen over time.

 

[bignastystacks]

RLDSL- can you give me a breif explanation of what an were the rag joint is so I can check it. My shocks are getting replaced next week but they are pretty shot. If the axle has rotated would an Alignment shop be able to restore it to it original position?

I have a d60 front axel not the twin I beam.

 

[bignastystacks]

I would assume this is the joint where the steering shaft connects to the PS box.

 

[Clayton]

I would assume this is the joint where the steering shaft connects to the PS box.

Yes.

 

[RLDSL]

RLDSL- can you give me a breif explanation of what an were the rag joint is so I can check it. My shocks are getting replaced next week but they are pretty shot. If the axle has rotated would an Alignment shop be able to restore it to it original position?

I have a d60 front axel not the twin I beam.

Yes, the rag joint is the flat round rubber/fabric disc at the end of the steering shaft that connects the shaft to the steering box. they get VERY soft with age and eventually give out. If that is the case, look into a Borgeson steering shaft to replace it, THose things will give you a set of U joints on each end and the difference in handling is night and day, but that bit about it wanting to grab near the end of travel makes me think it's the position of the axle and with it being a solid axle that makes me think it even more. Very simple fix for an alignment shop well versed in 4x4, They just have to loosen the hanger nuts and rotate the axle and insert various shims to adjust the KPI ( King Pin Inclination ) This is the angle between the upper and lower pivot point in the steering knuckle. The axle should be positioned where the lower joint is slightly forward of the upper joint ( positive caster ) and the upper slightly behind. If the axle is rotated to where this is reversed ( negitive caster) it will among other things have the handling effect of riding a bicycle with the handlebars and forks turned around backwards

 

[bignastystacks]

Ill check into the rag joint and sounds like I need to get into the alignment shop.

 

[LA350]

I was having considerable amounts of shaking in my front end and chewing up tires like crazy. I rebuilt every thing from the Pittman arm to the wheels using Moog parts. Rock solid now, and greasable too

The difference in size was eaily noticable too, the Moog part was quite beefy compaired w/ the OEM part. A little bit more money but well worth the cost.

 

[nyteshades]

Yes, the rag joint is the flat round rubber/fabric disc at the end of the steering shaft that connects the shaft to the steering box. they get VERY soft with age and eventually give out. If that is the case, look into a Borgeson steering shaft to replace it, THose things will give you a set of U joints on each end and the difference in handling is night and day, but that bit about it wanting to grab near the end of travel makes me think it's the position of the axle and with it being a solid axle that makes me think it even more. Very simple fix for an alignment shop well versed in 4x4, They just have to loosen the hanger nuts and rotate the axle and insert various shims to adjust the KPI ( King Pin Inclination ) This is the angle between the upper and lower pivot point in the steering knuckle. The axle should be positioned where the lower joint is slightly forward of the upper joint ( positive caster ) and the upper slightly behind. If the axle is rotated to where this is reversed ( negitive caster) it will among other things have the handling effect of riding a bicycle with the handlebars and forks turned around backwards

So if you're getting ready to swap a front end, is there anyway to make sure the angle is set correctly in the driveway?

 

[bignastystacks]

I was having considerable amounts of shaking in my front end and chewing up tires like crazy. I rebuilt every thing from the Pittman arm to the wheels using Moog parts. Rock solid now, and greasable too

The difference in size was eaily noticable too, the Moog part was quite beefy compaired w/ the OEM part. A little bit more money but well worth the cost.

There sure is a size difference. The old tie rods were considerably smaller than the new ones. I like the grease zirks too.

 

[OB_WAN]

I'm having similar symptoms in mine. So far I've replaced the tierod which made it a a "little" better. I then replaced the rotors/brake pads and rebuilt the calipers(because I had worn pads and warped rotors). while replacing the rotors, I did notice my hubs were a little loose on the spindles so set those up better.

I still get the drift issue while turning. I'm definitely pointing my focus on either the rag joint(high probability) or worn out bushings in the kingpin causing side-to-side play in the knuckles(because I'm also getting a "clunk" while making sharp turns). I don't believe either has been replaced so both are possible culprits.

Regarding caster. It's possible that as the springs settle, caster can be affected but on a vehicle with flat springs, the mounting point in the middle of the spring, and the flex point at the front of the spring, I'd think it wouldn't be as severe. A quick way to tell if you still have positive caster(but not a good way to tell if you have the correct amount of positive caster) is while driving, turn the wheel and let go. If it wants to return to center(driving straight), that's positive caster. if it stays where you're going, it's close to 0 caster. if it wants to turn even sharper, that's negative caster.

 

[bignastystacks]

Well I got under and checked all the tie rod nuts. Two of them had loosened up enough to apparently cause the issue still. I tightened up the two loose ones (pitman arm and right side) and I have been trying to recreate the issue for four days now but I do not have any issues with steering now. I am still going to check the rag joint and probably replace my steering components due to a leak.

OB WAN: I have not experienced any clunk or noise of any kind. I am pretty confident that the loose tie rods were causing the slop and your issue sounds a bit more serious with the noise involved.

I checked my axle and there isnt any visible signs of axle rotation but I dont think there would be. I am going to hold out for now and I am hoping that the issue is resolved. Ill let you know