Couple quick alternator questions

[Redneck]

I need to use my ford to drive up island a couple hundred kms to get a load of toyota parts this sunday. That leaves me tonight to diagnose the problem, tomorrow on lunch to order parts, and saturday to fix the truck, since I work 730am-8pm every other night this week.

The truck has been sitting for a couple months, and my wife refuses to understand the importance of LEAVING THE TRUCK PLUGGED IN. So it was pretty damn cold when I tried to start it yesterday. Glow plugs for 7 seconds, got about three cranks, and the batteries were dead. They're both new within the last year, and I've been starting it once a month, just so the truck doesn't think I don't love it.
Jump started off my S10, but the voltmeter still looked below normal range, and the last time I was driving it, I would have to give it a blip on the throttle to get the volt meter to jump up to normal range. On my old toyota, I had a big ass GM one wire alt, and was told that I needed to blip the throttle to "excite the field" and it would start charging at 14.7V.
It always worked great, so I figured the alt on the Ford needed that, due to being old.

After idling in the driveway for 20 minutes or so, I shut it off, and it didn't have the juice to restart. Got out my multi meter tonight, and after jump starting again, found the alternator is only putting out 12.3V. I figure this means it's ******** the bed gradually, and the time has come to replace/upgrade.
Am I right?

I can get a 100amp alt for the same price as a 70amp that the parts store says is stock. I figure I might as well get a bigger one. Any issues with this?



ok, so I lied, the questions are long and drawn out. Thanks for reading it and helping me out!

 

[riotwarrior]

First, it COULD be the Alt, or Voltage reg or just connections causing enough resistance...but sounds like it's Alt or reg...

I'd suggest taking Alt in for testing...see what they say...IIRC Can tire can check alt for you...

If it checks ok then I"d suggest the voltage reg...

It's not a simple solution I know....and seeing your coastal...corrosion is big issue probably too..

Clean battery terminals up super good...recheck all grounds to block etc and hope that clears it up...remember cleaning...FREE...

JM2CW

Al

And if it was me...I'd 3G it....not replace it with same alt...but a 3G...

 

[Redneck]

what's a 3G?

I don't have an idiot book for this motor, where's the voltage regulator, and how do I test it?

When I saw what the alt was putting out, I was checking it at the post on the alt, and at the battery, alt was 12.30V and battery was 12.28V. Guessing the regulator was between those two points?

and as to corrosion, yeah, I can damn near spit in the saltchuck from my house, we were this >< close to evacuation from the quake up the the charlottes last month.

 

[chris142]

Starting it and only letting it run a few minutes wont recharge the batteries. If you keep doing this they will just get more run down every time. You should invest in a battery charger and maintainer.

 

[riotwarrior]

what's a 3G?

I don't have an idiot book for this motor, where's the voltage regulator, and how do I test it?

When I saw what the alt was putting out, I was checking it at the post on the alt, and at the battery, alt was 12.30V and battery was 12.28V. Guessing the regulator was between those two points?

and as to corrosion, yeah, I can damn near spit in the saltchuck from my house, we were this >< close to evacuation from the quake up the the charlottes last month.

Voltage reg should be on RIGHT hand...passengers side...inner fender a small box about 2.5x3.5 inches 1 inch thick...grey plug on it quite wide...held down with 6 or 7 mm screws IIRC could be 8mm or 5/16 too...rofl..

basically right below where the stock jack is on the fender itself.

Testing it...um....replace it if you get 13.5-14.6 volts after that...it was the reg...if not you get same as before...sounds like Alt...Usually if it goes the voltage spikes considerably....18+

As for a 3G alternator it is a new internally regulated one!
http://www.fullsizebronco.com/forum/showthread.php?t=26658

Read that...it's a nice upgrade for your truck...

 

[redneckaggie]

get the alt tested and if it checks good replace the voltage reg,

 

[Wyreth]

If your alternator is bad, it's usually a good idea to replace your voltage regulator as well.

Like Riotwarrior said, if you are going to replace your alt, put in a "3G" alternator instead of stock.
information on it from the tech articles:
http://www.oilburners.net/forums/showthread.php?14573-130-amp-3G-alternator-install

 

[Tim4]

And if you replace, play with, clean the connections, or just wiggle the wires on the voltage regulator, unhook both negative cables first.

 

[riotwarrior]

And if you replace, play with, clean the connections, or just wiggle the wires on the voltage regulator, unhook both negative cables first.

Very good tip....Thanks....

It's kinda like pulling teeth on a lion....would ya rather pull the tooth when it's asleep....knocked out.....or awake....

Well why mess with your charging system with the truck running or grounds connected and potentially cause failure of parts...if shorted out by accident....cause we all know that none of us here have ever made a boo boo..

 

[rhkcommander]

I had similar issues, 3g 130 amp alternator and two new batteries were the cure

 

[Jake_IN]

Probably already found the voltage regulator but I'll post the pic anyway.

voltage regulator is the little whiteish box that says select. ITs kind of under those perfectly ran perfectly organized perfectly labled wires and relays above it

You must be registered for see images

Hey the wires are a work in progress give me a break

 

[riotwarrior]

Jake, I'm guessing that's yer name....

Ok so looks to me like you hit the nail on the head....YELLOW box in my pic voltage reg....RED BOX...*** is that wiring mess....I'd be getting all over that and then some IF i was you....IIRC thats the glow plug circuit wiring...or...or it's the Alternator and IP and various other wires that need immediate attention...

You must be registered for see images attach

I see other stuff too...I just can't tell what's what...rofl

Hope this helps..

Al

 

[Jake_IN]

Jake, I'm guessing that's yer name....

Ok so looks to me like you hit the nail on the head....YELLOW box in my pic voltage reg....RED BOX...*** is that wiring mess....I'd be getting all over that and then some IF i was you....IIRC thats the glow plug circuit wiring

You must be registered for see images attach

I see other stuff too...I just can't tell what's what...rofl

Hope this helps..

Al

Yep good job with figuring out my name.

Yep the yellow box is correct and the red box well...that would be sloppy seconds left from previous owners. Its the stupid engine harness connector that the glow plug wires melted. Well it melted the connector and somebody just soldered the wires together separate from the melted plug. Its on my to do list but not the highest priority at the moment.

Also how'd you get the box on the picture? you just save it and add them in paint or something?

 

[LCAM-01XA]

Jake, I suppose your glowplugs work good with the wires as is, but till you have time to organize/fix the connector mess at least wrap it w/ some electrical tape - those wires are always hot off the starter relay on the fender, and being 10awg they can carry quite a bit of current. They do have a fuse link at their beginning, meaning if they short to ground (and that big metal plate under them IS grounded) there won't be just one big spark and that's it like it happens w/ most fuses, rather it will be a slower process with ample heat generation and who knows what destructive consequences... Actually as long as the rest of your connector is not badly corroded or falling apart there is no real need to mess w/ it, just taping up the bare sections of the plug wires should be all that's needed for safety.

Also, Al brought up an excellent point about corrosion at the VR wiring (not in Jake's truck, but in general) - the connector there is not sealed like the ones on alternator-mounted regulators are, heck you can't even pack it properly w/ dielectric grease to keep moisture out of the contacts. Also the regulator IIRC don't have its own ground, and instead grounds through the metal plate it's bolted onto, which is grounded to the outer fender via a short wire and a sheetmetal screw - compromise that ground connection and the VR will no longer work properly. For this reason before converting to the 3G alt w/ a built-in regulator I added anothe ground for the VR, this one running directly to the passenger-side battery's negative terminal. Then on the driver side I did the same for the PCM ground (non-applicable for those of ya'll w C6 and ZF5), only this one I extended by a foot or two so it can reach the driver-side battery directly, instead of grounding through the cab's sheetmetal like the factory decided to make it.

 

[Jake_IN]

just taping up the bare sections of the plug wires should be all that's needed for safety.

Yeah, i have contemplated melting the solder to separate the wire so i could side a shrink tube over it then re soldering it. I just really hate the goo electrical tape leaves on everything (lame excuse for why i haven't taped it but its the only one i have). I'll get to it at some point but I'm 2.5 hours away from my truck and when I'm home I usually don't have much time to work on it.