NTOLERANCE
I'm the cotton swab
Since my van is more of a people hauler it well, rides like crap - Anyone rung bags int he front for better ride? What were your mods and results?
Anyone running air bags in the FRONT?
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LCAM-01XA
Full Access Member
Are you 100% certain it's the front giving you the crappy ride, and not the rear? When our truck was still 2wd (essentially the same suspension like your van, minor differences in I-beam design die to swaybar ends) the front pretty much just floated over everything, it was the rear axle that felt like it might as well be bolted directly to the frame.
Now that's out of the way, there you go, it's a truck but the suspension is darn near identical to what you're working with:
http://www.duallyscene.com/forums/post107174.html
He's a member here too, this here guy:
http://www.oilburners.net/forums/member.php?12344-93cc7-3
NTOLERANCE
I'm the cotton swab
Well. It's a van. So my left foot is over the fender well while driving. I have good shocks on it but they aren't high quality so I will change them out Van has been aligned. I had worn I beam pivot bushings and well they helped a lot when I replaced them. But it's still a rough ride in the front and I would assume the rear as well
My dad's Motorhome has air bags and when inflated it rides a lot better. I also have read where people have installed them and found improved ride quality. Wondering if they swapped the front springs out?
Challenges are what makes life interesting. Overcoming them is what makes life meaningful.
My dad's Motorhome has air bags and when inflated it rides a lot better. I also have read where people have installed them and found improved ride quality. Wondering if they swapped the front springs out?
Challenges are what makes life interesting. Overcoming them is what makes life meaningful.
NTOLERANCE
I'm the cotton swab
After looking at the pics of that dually I was thinking more along the lines of bags inside the springs ........
Challenges are what makes life interesting. Overcoming them is what makes life meaningful.
Challenges are what makes life interesting. Overcoming them is what makes life meaningful.
LCAM-01XA
Full Access Member
Adding any additional spring elements (air or otherwise) to the current coil springs you already consider too stiff is going to have the exact opposite effect of what you're trying to achieve. The in-coil bladders you're thinking of have one purpose only - to lift the nose of the truck back up after the steel springs have sagged either due to wear or excessive weight on the axle (like a snow plow for example). If your springs are not sagging now, and you don't plan on carrying half of your worldly possessions in a Knaack-type jobsite storage chest hung in front of your bumper, then installing the air bladders will just make you bard ride quality even worse...
Two ways you can get soft ride - longer and softer coils, and full air. If it were a truck with leaf springs you have a 3rd option as well, the lowest GVW springs you can find with a set of 7" air bellows on top of them, the leaves will locate the axle and the air bellows will hold a good chunk of the weight. Well I supposed you can do that with the coils too, like use springs for say a E150 with a 302 engine and shove the air bladders inside them, but then you run into the whole small air volume = crappy ride thing again.
Something most folks tend to ignore, what's your air pressure in the tires? Check what the door sticker calls for and match it, it may just do the trick. LT235/85-16E tires become rather stiff when pumped all the way up to 80psi...
ironworker40
NYC Ironworker
My dad always ran d load rang tires that he swore helped the ride. Okay if your not haulin or towing heavy
NTOLERANCE
I'm the cotton swab
I run 245/75r16 load e tires. They were noticeably less harsh than the 235/85r16.
Challenges are what makes life interesting. Overcoming them is what makes life meaningful.
Challenges are what makes life interesting. Overcoming them is what makes life meaningful.
Not quite the same as air bags, but been using a set of air shocks in front.
Have 235/75/16 E range tires, can't really say the air shocks helped the ride, I put them on to try to lift the front a little.
Don't think it helped much in that department either, (lol)
Have 235/75/16 E range tires, can't really say the air shocks helped the ride, I put them on to try to lift the front a little.
Don't think it helped much in that department either, (lol)
LCAM-01XA
Full Access Member
Again, adding ANYTHING that behaves like a spring (air shocks, in-coil air bladders, 4" air bellows on the radius arms, whatever) to suspension that is already considered too harsh will NOT improve your ride one bit, it will in fact worsen it. Air shocks in particular are the worst offenders, due to their relatively small air volume even a relatively small suspension up-travel when hitting a bump will dramatically raise their air pressure, which in turn stops the suspension from traveling up any further - you end up with a short-travel harsh suspesnion.
If you've ever played with air-over-oil motorcycle forks this is the same principle - your initial air pressure determines how stiff the fork will be on small bumps, and oil level (effectively changes air volume above it) determines how progressive compression will be (basically how far up she will travel on large bumps). For smooth ride you want both the static air pressure and the oil level as low as you can get them without bottoming the thing out when you run into something big. It's a balancing act of course, and larger vehicle suspension is no different.
Brad S. you can use air bellows on top of your leaves. They will go between the frame rails and plate that clamps the leaves down onto the axle, so you'll have to lose the bump stops. If the leaves end up sitting flat (no negative arch to them like they have from the factory) you will have enough clearance for 6"-7" (diameter) double-convoluted bellows without bottoming your axle. Or, if bottoming out is a concern, they do make air springs with built-in internal bump stops - which is what you really wanna run in these trucks, especially if they're not lifted. The non-bumpstop springs are very affordable, and they require very little in the ways of fabrication to install them. Still going to ride rough, but at least the ride height will be where you want it.
If you've ever played with air-over-oil motorcycle forks this is the same principle - your initial air pressure determines how stiff the fork will be on small bumps, and oil level (effectively changes air volume above it) determines how progressive compression will be (basically how far up she will travel on large bumps). For smooth ride you want both the static air pressure and the oil level as low as you can get them without bottoming the thing out when you run into something big. It's a balancing act of course, and larger vehicle suspension is no different.
Brad S. you can use air bellows on top of your leaves. They will go between the frame rails and plate that clamps the leaves down onto the axle, so you'll have to lose the bump stops. If the leaves end up sitting flat (no negative arch to them like they have from the factory) you will have enough clearance for 6"-7" (diameter) double-convoluted bellows without bottoming your axle. Or, if bottoming out is a concern, they do make air springs with built-in internal bump stops - which is what you really wanna run in these trucks, especially if they're not lifted. The non-bumpstop springs are very affordable, and they require very little in the ways of fabrication to install them. Still going to ride rough, but at least the ride height will be where you want it.
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