Odd stalling issue that has progressed

kbrennan

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So my red mess has finally given me a run for my money and I haven't been able to puzzle through it reading old threads and tinkering.

A few months ago it started stalling occasionally when I let off the throttle and decelerating. It always immediately started right back up on the first spin of the starter.

Figured it was some sort of air intrusion or leak issue, hunted around, didn't find anything obvious to hear or see. Then one day on an errand run (with multiple stops), on the last stop it lost prime in the parking lot, having been gone all of 20 minutes. I was parked on a very slight incline, so figured it drained back and there really was an air intrusion issue somewhere that I just hadn't found yet.

So as a stop-gap, I finally added an electric pump inline with the mechanical just to prime it. a couple check valves into a street tee into the stock filter head. Teed off the tank line to feed both pumps.

This helped take care of the priming issue so I could keep chugging around, without much issue. Wherever the air intrusion is, it wasn't affecting the running condition, so makes me think its return line area. Thinking I should get some clear hose off the pump at some point.

I also changed the fuel filter shortly after since it had been far too long. Fair amount of water in the separator, but not full.

A tank and a half later, it starts stalling again, this time much much worse. Fire it off, go for a bit, let off the throttle, stall, pretty much every time. I could feather the throttle a little bit and keep it alive and limp home.

Then we went off to see the in-laws and venture about, so it sat for a couple weeks.

Now I'm back, completely lost prime, total bear to start, nothing coming out of the tail pipe, until the priming pump finally caught up, but it took *way* longer than it should.
Idles like a top once it fires off, sounds just like always, little clatter, but not too much.

Rev it up in neutral to about 1400, let off gently, and it falls flat on its face and stalls, but fires on the first spin right after the stall. But also once it hits 1400 or so, it starts sounding like there is some metal on metal contact, or rubbing going on. Drop below the threshold, it stops, totally happy again, no angry sound.

Of course, since this is an Arizona summer, idling long enough will get it up to temp and with the little revs here and there to see whats going on and whether or not I can keep it alive with some throttle poking as the revs come down. So after a bit, I think the cold advance cut out, and instead of the metal on metal sound going, it starts missing occasionally above 1400rpm or so. Mostly pretty rhythmic, but occasionally out of time, like its not the same cylinder missing.
Still stalls on rpm drop.

So I think there is probably a few things going on and need to fix one at a time, or maybe its just one tricky issue to work out thats got me stumped.
I guess I'm also trying to work out where the air intrusion is without tearing into it too much, way too hot to be doing that right now haha

Thanks in advance for the advice and suggestions
 

gandalf

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The stalling issue is the classic sign of a sticking metering valve in the IP. I'd guess that your IP is getting old.

You may be able to clean it, maybe. Find a really good fuel treatment. Remove the fuel filter, empty it and fill it with the fuel treatment. Carefully screw it back on, so as to not lose too much. Start the engine and let it run until you hear a slight change in the engine sound, and shut it off. That should take no more than about 30 seconds. Let the truck sit over night, with the fuel treatment sitting in the IP. The next day start it up and drive it hard.

This usually/frequently works simply by cleaning the metering valve in the IP. However, it's usually an indication that your IP is getting old and will need replacement before too long. Start saving your lunch money.
 

Weldingman

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The stalling issue is the classic sign of a sticking metering valve in the IP. I'd guess that your IP is getting old.

You may be able to clean it, maybe. Find a really good fuel treatment. Remove the fuel filter, empty it and fill it with the fuel treatment. Carefully screw it back on, so as to not lose too much. Start the engine and let it run until you hear a slight change in the engine sound, and shut it off. That should take no more than about 30 seconds. Let the truck sit over night, with the fuel treatment sitting in the IP. The next day start it up and drive it hard.

This usually/frequently works simply by cleaning the metering valve in the IP. However, it's usually an indication that your IP is getting old and will need replacement before too long. Start saving your lunch money.
My 86 did the same thing and this worked for me. I filled my fuel filter with dieselkleen ran the motor for 15 seconds and let it sit for 24 hours has been great since.
 

kbrennan

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What’s your idle set at?

How old is the Injection Pump?
Idles around 800rpm.

IP is probably old, it has a red dot on it, so i think it's been replaced at least once. I haven't done it since owning it the last 20k miles.

I will pick up some diesel kleen or ATF and fill the filter and try that.

I'll start planning to buy a new pump. moose diesel the best now that they took over from Conestoga?
 

kbrennan

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Cool.

I did the diesel kleen in the filter and soak. I ran it hard yesterday all over the valley of the sun. Feels like a brand new truck almost. It starts on the first spin every time now, whether its hot or cold.
Thanks for the advice, really appreciated.

I still think it probably needs to be timed, but that can wait until I buy a new pump.

The fuel sender in the front tank seems completely wonky, but also the rear tank to some degree. I guess this probably means something is up with the gauge cluster.

My voltmeter shows the system voltage to be stable, a little high (~14V, but its an analog one, so makes sense), so it doesn't seem like that would be the cause if that was fluctuating a lot.

Could be a bad ground on the dash? or more like to be back near the tanks?
I'm not sure what the most common failure modes on these senders is, or if the sender just went out completely.
 

Cubey

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My RV did that at first, but it was due to very old diesel in the tank. Once it got fresh diesel mixed in run through it, it quit doing it.
 
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