stanadyne DB4 vs modified DB2|||DB4 parts into a DB2? Marine pumps?

[icanfixall]

Very well said Mel. I feel I'm like the original poster in WANTING to do something like this myself but.. Whats stopping me is exactly what you have posted. Now if I felt I could do it myself I would. but never really knowing if it was done right bothers me. I was just reading a pm from a member that is using one of my timing meters. In all of his posts he felt his timing was fine but just wanted to check it to be sure. Well he posted his timing was 5.1 advance.... Thats kind of low even for the factory setting. Its now 8.5 advance and he made a few more adjustments where he marked the pump to different degrees of timing. Now he knows that each mark is and can adjust timing without a meter just as long as he keeps this pump. Had he never checked the pump and felt it was "ok" running he would never have know whats left on the timing table. Once again you clearly explain what and how these pumps do their magic for these idi engine.

 

[BDCarrillo]

Video of the calibration rig

 

[riotwarrior]

Video of the calibration rig

Can I try this at home...
NO Friggen WAY

 

[marmot]

Oh hell no! That bench is very well made and you would be lost without it. I would listen to agnem on this one man he knows what he is talking about.

 

[jay22day]

The problem that you are going to run into, is that most DB4 pumps are 6 cylinders. A stock DB2 cam ring will not work with a 4 roller rotor.

So your saying a db4 cam ring would have to be purchased and installed with the db4 four roller rotor?

i did notice db4's are easier to find in 6 cylinder applications (seems like a lot of john deer tractors had them?), they do and did offer 8 cylinder pumps. the 8 cylinder db4 has a 320 hp rating thats more than enough for most everyone looking for a performance pump, for these trucks.

 

[jay22day]

thanks, i have already watched that, it says two tests are being performed: max fuel and fuel cut off at high idle.


i see no "tuning" occurring. All i can really take from the vid is that they're "bench testing" it.

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Mel, so that we may all have abetter understanding of this machine, could you explain to us what the machine actually does? You probably the only one on the forum with first hand experience with this equipment.

This is obviously speculation, BUT, it looks like a fancy glorified injection pump "DYNO" to me

 

[jay22day]

I love running across stuff like this:

I finished my reassembly and I got the pump installed back on the truck. After cranking for a while, (these IDIs take some time to bleed the injectors), she finally coughed, and I bled it some more, hit the manual glow plug button for a few seconds and she fired up. I went for a short drive and it is running great, and NOT LEAKING ANYMORE!!!

The outlook I have on all this is that if you are a person who can follow directions, take your time, and be fanatically clean and careful with precision parts, then you can take this manual and disassemble, inspect and reassemble a Stanadyne DB2 pump.

The manual does call for a few special tools, like a seal expander to install the new drive shaft seals over the shaft, but I made it fine without them. I just took my time and was able to work the seals in place by hand without much trouble. The only “special” tool I used was a little wire hook I made to hold the fuel shutoff solenoid plunger back while installing the top cover. And, the manual showed me how it needed to be shaped. Other than that it was just an inch lb torque wrench, snap ring pliers and ordinary hand tools and allen wrenches.

this guy wrote an awesome article on how he simply marked the calibration points prior to dis-assembly, while doing the simple seal replacement. Which is exactly what im planning to do.
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1952
Standard Screw introduces the Roosa Master Injection Pump, the world's first Diesel Rotary Pump.

1958 Standard Screw builds on its diesel fuel pump line with the introduction of the DB Model Rotary Pump.

Stanadyne didnt start making a different pump untill 1993- Stanadyne develops the DS Model Rotary Pump, the first electronically governed pump of its kind.

 

[BDCarrillo]

The part you didn't mention from that other article was the friendly shop that sold him some worn hard parts.

You'd need that test rig for properly setting your timing advance plunger, max fuel delivery, fuel "curve," and verifying equal delivery to all injectors, proper case pressure, governor spring...

I am riding the fence on this... it's feasible to do acceptably, but very difficult to do "right"

 

[Clb]

As Mel stated ( the guru) in case you missed it.
I understand and appreciate your desire to do it yourself, but the reality is this. Without the calibration bench, you will never be able to get that thing to run right. It may work OK, and maybe even well enough to fool you into thinking you did a good job, but it will not be RIGHT. All you have to do is loosen that T-27 torx on the cam on your throttle shaft, and move it a tiny hair, and its not going to be great anymore. Heck, it sometimes takes me 6 or 10 tries to get that thing dialed in, using the right equipment. And all the adjustments are inter-related. You cannot just keep changing one thing thinking it is going to turn out alright. It's true that these pumps were invented way back when, but they were simpler versions of what you have. The test equipment was developed in order to further develop the pump. There is no way I would rebuild a pump without a calibration bench. It would be a better use of my time to buy from one of those companies in the ebay "hey here is a pump for $300" category and bolt it on my engine, because in essence, they are doing exactly what you propose to do. There is no satisfaction in doing a job yourself, only to realize it will produce an inferior product then what you had before.[/QUOTE]
But please come back and tell us how killer it runs.
Cb

 

[riotwarrior]

Talk to Justin Anderson about a DB2/4 hybrid pump....he's in the know...

I've met him he's a great fellow to deal with!

R n D IDI performance

http://idiperformance.com/pumps.php

He may be able to address yer issues if Mel cannot

Just sayin

 

[riotwarrior]

Oh on a side note about the RnD pump...

His DB4 uses a 7.3 pump cam ring, he just mods the ring for the bigger pin otherwise it's a complete drop in for a 7.3...

Just sayin....

Done some research ....

 

[jay22day]

The part you didn't mention from that other article was the friendly shop that sold him some worn hard parts.

I'm not sure what you mean. The article i read and posted that from is another webpage (also, its not a forum).

 

[jay22day]

Oh on a side note about the RnD pump...

His DB4 uses a 7.3 pump cam ring, he just mods the ring for the bigger pin otherwise it's a complete drop in for a 7.3...

Just sayin....

Done some research ....

thanks riotwarrior!

So he builds the pumps himself?

 

[BDCarrillo]

I'm not sure what you mean. The article i read and posted that from is another webpage (also, its not a forum).

I read that article you quoted (or one very similar) and the guy had to get a few replacement parts from a local shop. New internals for those pumps aren't readily available to the general public (us)

 

[jay22day]

I read that article you quoted (or one very similar) and the guy had to get a few replacement parts from a local shop. New internals for those pumps aren't readily available to the general public (us)

i think it was a different, yet similar, article because the gentleman that wrote that article i read only used a $30 seal rebuild kit because he had a small leak. Worked great for him afterwards. He felt he could do the rebuild after reading a prior write up from a gentleman that did his own pump rebuild, and took it to be bench tested at a shop, he said: the guy did such a good job the shop attempted to offer him a job rebuilding pumps, apparently the pump needed no further adjustment, even though he did it at home with the fancy injection pump dyno.


stanadyne has over 1000 authorized parts and service dealers, i have yet to run across a single automotive part , that is readily available, but is not available for "over the counter purchase". If a small shop owner tells you that he cant sell you just the part, hes just trying to sell you on a pump or having him do the rebuild. A stanadyne dealer needs to be contacted and not any old diesel shop.

The only company that does this in any way is banks, but they dont offer any parts for there products to anyone including pro/commercial shops because they want to sell you a entire turbo cartridge and not just the wheel. A cartridge is the equivalent of buying a new turbo so what that simply means is banks doesn't offer or have any replacement parts (as they ahve told me this sever times over the phone ) stupid banks...