93fordturbo
Full Access Member
Best way to jack up drivers side of motor . I have a 6.9 and gotta put a frost plug in
jack up motor to put frost plug in
- Thread starter 93fordturbo
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jaluhn83
Full Access Member
Unbolt motor; use jack.
FYI, complete sentences and coherent questions are your friend.
FYI, complete sentences and coherent questions are your friend.
93fordturbo
Full Access Member
I don't think I need an English lesson here. I knew I would have to take bolts out and jack the motor up. Is there a safe place to jack the motor up underneath? Is it better to pick from the top. Any tips, hints, etc.? How long of a job am I looking at for the average backyard mechanic? I need to get to the plug that is covered up by a mount, or part of the frame,it has been a while since I looked at it.
jaluhn83
Full Access Member
Ask an unclear snippy question, expect an unclear snippy answer. If you want someone to go to the time and effort of typing out a useful and clear answer, the least you could do is be clear exactly what your question is and act appreciative.
If it's the plug under the motor mount you may be best off pulling the motor unfortunately. You need to be able to get clear direct access to the plug to get in there with the proper tool and a hammer. IIRC that plug winds up directly in line with the cross member, so even once you jack it up and pull the mount you still can't really get in there well.
Further, these engines use disc plugs, not the more common dish plugs. This means that installing them is somewhat harder and ideally requires a special tool, and further, you cannot just stick a rubber expending plug in like you can with cup plugs.
I'd jack under the harmonic balancer (making sure to use a board and jack the balancer, not the pulley) or possibly the oil pan making sure to use a solid board to distribute the load.
~John
If it's the plug under the motor mount you may be best off pulling the motor unfortunately. You need to be able to get clear direct access to the plug to get in there with the proper tool and a hammer. IIRC that plug winds up directly in line with the cross member, so even once you jack it up and pull the mount you still can't really get in there well.
Further, these engines use disc plugs, not the more common dish plugs. This means that installing them is somewhat harder and ideally requires a special tool, and further, you cannot just stick a rubber expending plug in like you can with cup plugs.
I'd jack under the harmonic balancer (making sure to use a board and jack the balancer, not the pulley) or possibly the oil pan making sure to use a solid board to distribute the load.
~John
93fordturbo
Full Access Member
Why can't rubber expandable plugs be used. There isn't much pressure is there. I only need it to last a year or two until I pull the motor.
icanfixall
Official GMM hand model
Actually your going to need a little more than just some words of help. First off these are not the regular cup type plugs. They are a special concave shape plug and they demand the proper tool to install them. So in an effort to help you do this I strongly recommend buy only the factory stainless steel plugs and beg borrow or steal the special tool for installing them. I feel you have not done this job before and this is no place to learn by doing it wrong. I have plenty of first hand experiance doing this and I learned the hard expensive way twice to do it correctly. When the proper tool and the only plug garrenteed to work is used there is no way to know that its done properly. Now have said that I will explain. There is only one way to know you have installed them properly and thats to remove them. Thats going to ruin what you just did. The factory plugs are designed to cut into the edges of the plug bore. they sit on a recessed register. Then the tool holds them in place when you hit the tool with a hammer. that hammer hit spreads the plug out by dimpleing it in the center spreading it. Use a good quality RTV or permatex avaitation cement to seal them in. I didn't do that when I installed my second set of factory oem plugs. I air tested to 35 lbs and checked every pluf for leaks with Snoop Leak Detecter and found no leaks. If you ever what to find and air leak use that stuff. The small leaks show up as almost shaving foam the bubbles are that small. A large leak wil blow away the leak check stuff. But anyway these are nothing to fool around with. We have seen plenty of trouble with members installing these plugs with a punch and hammer and using brass or steel plug material.. It just does not work and the experiance of this forum proves this time and time again. If I had the tool named OTC 303-D045 I would loan it to you but I don't have it. Maybe some of the members here will loan you the tool. Its not a tool that can be ruined by improper use. As for jacking up the engine please don't use the bottom of the oil pan unless your going to use a piece of wood that covers the complete bottom and has a cutout for the drain plug opening. Reason for this wood is the oil pump suction is only about 1/8 inch off the bottom of the pan. It can be crushed up and then the suction is not going to be correct. The freeze plugs can be bought one at a time or in a bag of 7 to do the complete engine. Three are on the drivers side. Two are behind the flywheel and two are on the passenger side. For the drivers side you will probably need to remove the oil cooler because it covers much of that side of the block. Please ask for more help if you need some. Plenty of members have been thru this before. I'm actually surprised you have a freeze plug that failed because the factory plugs are stainless steel.
icanfixall
Official GMM hand model
To explain your last question its like this. The plugs have a lip in the plug bore that the plug rests in so you can hammer it inplce. Like posted. These are a dished type plug and not a simple cup type plug. So thinking you can use a rubber expanding plug is really not going to work. The rubber plug will not be able to get a purchase on the small lip thats machined where the plug fits. That inside lip is not machined either so thinking you could maybe place a rubber expanding plug in that may not work either. I have a block here thats got some plugs removed that I did some testing on. I will measure the ruff cast inside demension and post what I find. Just maybe you can find a rubber plug that might work. I'm not hopefull but thats what I can do for you.
jaluhn83
Full Access Member
Rubber plugs don't fit, or at least I haven't seen any that would fit. Standard cup plugs have a machined smooth ID and the plug press fits into that bore. The idi motors use a disc plug that seats against a machined lip - this leaves a rough cast non standard ID in the actual center of the opening which the rubber plug would have to seal against.
93fordturbo
Full Access Member
A master mechanic told me that when those plugs blow out, there is a real good chance I cracked the block. Is this true. He said they werecasting holes not for frost. Any of this true.
icanfixall
Official GMM hand model
Ok here is the size of the plug opening. That area of the plug fit is 1.149 so thats about 1 1/2 inch plug. The lip thats not machined for a fit is about 1.126 or just over 1 1/8 inch opening. Now short of telling you that a 1 1/8 inch expandable rubber plug will fit and work is not going to happen. If I had done this then yes, I could tell you it will or wil not work. Can you tell me which plug your going to be replacing on the drivers side. The plug back over the oil filter is the easy one. then there are two forwards of that behind the oil cooler bundle and they are harder to see or work on when the engine is in the truck. Even worse on a van application.
jaluhn83
Full Access Member
Depends. Why did it "blow out'? If it froze and that's what pushed the plugs out then yes, there is some chance, but it's just leaking a bit it's pretty unlikely unless you overheated it badly.
The only block cracking issues I've heard of on these motors were in the early 6.9 engines caused by use of the block heater. Overheating tends to crack heads but never seen block cracks.
The only block cracking issues I've heard of on these motors were in the early 6.9 engines caused by use of the block heater. Overheating tends to crack heads but never seen block cracks.
icanfixall
Official GMM hand model
The master mechanic is wrong about most of that statement. there is a feeling that the plugs are there for frost expansion and a casting hole. I'm going with the expansion hole for frost. Blocks don't crack and loose freeze plugs. I know it can happen but so far I have not seen or read anything like that on this forum or another forum I came from. Its possible but unlikely its ture. Funny thing about these holes being the size they are. We could machine out the bore all the way in to 1.500 and then tap the holes for a 1 1/4 inch screwin freeze plug that the Boss 429 blocks use. Then we never need to worry again about a freeze plug issue. Only need to worry about a freeze and ruining a block. I would do this if I had a drill press large enough to handle a 1 1/2 inch drill bit or a Bridgeport mill where I could mill out the bores for the tap size of 1 1/4 inch tapered plugs. I have never been a fan of removing and installing new oem freeze plugs in these blocks after the troubles I have seen.
jaluhn83
Full Access Member
When I first got my truck it ha multiple freeze plugs pushed out almost certainly from freezing. I'm 95% sure it was filled with water for testing and then the radiator was drained but not the block and over the interceding ~10 years of sitting it kept freezing.
Personally I'd just drill them out to a standard diameter and run regular cup type plugs. They seem pretty reliable.
I've wondered why IH used this style of plug - doesn't seem any cheaper to manufacture and I can't think of any other advantages. Can't say I've seen any other engine that used them either. Does anyone know?
Personally I'd just drill them out to a standard diameter and run regular cup type plugs. They seem pretty reliable.
I've wondered why IH used this style of plug - doesn't seem any cheaper to manufacture and I can't think of any other advantages. Can't say I've seen any other engine that used them either. Does anyone know?
old dodges used them in everything.
icanfixall
Official GMM hand model
D.O.D.G.E.
Dads old dirty garage expirmint....
Nuff said......
Now making that statement I can say they made some really tuff sutff in their day. I recall the 426 dual quad hemis around 1967 thru 1970 engines. those were the beasts of the day. Then things fell off and the valiant and the volaire came along. Now about the meanest thing they have is the viper V10.. thats kind of a return of the beast of the dodge cars. but overall.. I still can't excuse the K cars....
Dads old dirty garage expirmint....
Nuff said......
Now making that statement I can say they made some really tuff sutff in their day. I recall the 426 dual quad hemis around 1967 thru 1970 engines. those were the beasts of the day. Then things fell off and the valiant and the volaire came along. Now about the meanest thing they have is the viper V10.. thats kind of a return of the beast of the dodge cars. but overall.. I still can't excuse the K cars....
