Dana 70 or Sterling 10.25?

bike-maker

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Here's an article on the Sterling;www.fourwheeler.com/techarticles/drivetrain/129_0611_1989_ford_f_250_disc_brakes/viewall.html
Here's one on the Dana 70;http://www.off-road.com/trucks-4x4/tech/dana-70-disc-brake-swap-18975.html

Just google dana 70 or Sterling 10.25 disc brake conversion and you'll find lots to read through.
They all appear to use rotors off the front of a 3/4 ton Chevy, and matching Chevy calipers or rear calipers from a Cadillac depending on whether or not you want a functional parking brake.
 

Maverick1701

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To me, this is a complicated answer because there are several Dana 70s (Dana 70, Dana 70U and Dana 70HD). There are three 10.25 Sterlings, the 5300# GAWR semi-float, the 6250# GAWR (Gross Axle Weight) full float and the fairly uncommon 10.25 DRW version (7400 or 8250 GAWR... the only differences between the weight ratings is the tubing wall thickness). The later 10.50 Sterling adds a few more variations but has the metic wheel bolt pattern. The 6250 GAWR Sterling is by leaps and bounds the most common.

Your '84 F350 is listed as having a Dana 70-2U originally, with a 6300# GAWR (Gross Axle Weight Rating... the axle pros pronounce that "Gowwer" rhyming with "Sour"). The Dana 70U first appeared in '84. Prior to that, F350 SRW had a mix of Dana 61s and Dana 70s.. depending on the axle ratio used (See "Original Dana 70" below)

From early '85 and earlier, you mostly found a Dana 61 full floater under F250 HDs and some F350s. It came as a semi-float for the 6600 GVW F250s and as a full floater in the F250 HD (4x4 and 4x2 in. 8600# GVW and larger). It's an oddball, ****** cousin of the Dana 60 that was redesigned so it could carry taller gears down to 3.07:1. It has a 9.75 inch ring gear and some of them have very odd pinion offsets so you can have trouble swapping gears. It has the same GAWR as the later Sterling. In fact, the Sterling was designed to replace this axle in early '85.

The original Dana 70... It shows up in some for applications prior to '85 but only where a ratio of 3.73 & lower was used. 3.73:1 is the lowest ratio that fits in a "regular" Dana 70. When the fuel crunch hit, they wanted taller ratios and Dana had to redesign the housings to fit taller gears and that's where the D70U line came in. Same goes for the D61 vs the original D60.

As far as I can see in my Data Books and Dana manuals, the only Dana 70 offered in F350 SRWs of this era was the Dana 70-1U or Dana 70-2U (generally considered in the D70U family... the "-1" indicates a version change). The "U" stands for "undersized pinion bearings. They aren't terrible axles but they have small pinion bearings and weird ring and pinion offsets that can make them tricky to work on and especially, to make a gear change on. Many people don't like the D70U in hard tow application because of the undersized pinion bearings. If something fails in hard towing use, that's what will go.

Dana 70HD... wasn't offered in Fords of our era except as a DRW. There were some rare SRW Dana 70HDs in GM trucks. This axle has very thick 4-inch diameter tubes and larger carrier bearings. With a larger ring gear, the D70HD morphed into the later Dana 80. Many people think the D70HD is a better axle than the D80.. but I won't bore you with the details.

So, after all this... I say go Sterling. It's plentiful, easy to ID and easy to work on with no oddball pinion offsets or anything to make them tricky. They can come in factory ratios of 3.07, 3.31, 3.73, 4.10, 4.30 4.56 (more ratios available from the aftermarket). Ford used a higher grade of steel in the axle shafts than Dana, SAE 1050 high carbon steel vs Dana's 1035 or 1040... so Ford's axle shafts are about 20 percent stronger. The Sterlings used 3.50 inch axle tubes, where the D61 and some D70s used 3.1-inch tubes. Most Dana 70s/70U use 3.56 inch tubes and the D70HD used 4 inch. Most 6250# Sterlings have .258 wall tubing, with the DRW versions using .448. The Dana D70Us listed for an '84 F350 SRW truck, 6300 GAWR, shows .410 wall tubing, where in the Sterling listed for the '85 model years, 6250 GAWR is listed with .258 wall for the F250 HD but .448 for the F350. I have verified the wall thickness of .258 in F250HDs but have never had the chance to do so on a SRW F350. It seems strange they would have .448 tubing on an axle still only rated for 6250#. Still, I would suggest trying to find a Sterling From an F350 vs an F250 on the off chance it has thicker wall tubing.

In general, Dana has the edge on axle tube thickness but supposedly, and I have not been able to verify this, Ford used a higher grade of steel in the HREW tubing on the Sterling than Dana used.


Wow thats a lot of great info!

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PwrSmoke

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Smokin'!

Oddly enough, I ran across a mid-'90s Ford F450 box van D70HD yesterday in a shop being worked on. You can see a "little bit" of wear on the ring and pinion :eek: due to lack of oil from a long term pinion leak. The other oddity is that it had an strange carrier and ring & pinion combo that was giving the tech fits. Turns out it had a carrier from a high gear ratio with an extra-thick 4.30:1 ring gear. The extra thick gear was more expensive than a new standard gear set plus the carrier that fit, so that's the way they went.

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bike-maker

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I took the cover off of mine today for a look-see......
Still had quite a bit of gear oil in it (and boy did it smell good!), although there was definitely a good spray coming off of the pinion and coating the whole underside of the truck. I can also see a bunch of splatter radiating out across the wheel/tires. So it looks like it had enough fluid in it, but it got so hot it expanded and gushed out of every orifice it could find. The bearings all appear to be in decent shape, the gears are another story. All the spider gears can just rattle around freely in the center section. The ring gear has a bunch of metal rolled up on the edges of all of the teeth. There's about 1/2" of sludge in the bottom of the case that used to be solid metal. I was able to rotate the pinion almost 45* back and forth. Think that's enough lash on the ring and pinion?

Bunch of metal filings, smells like death, excessive play on the ring and pinion.....as the truck's official coroner I'm forced to declare this poor rear axle DOA.

On the hunt for a new Sterling 10.25"

Maybe now's a good time for a dually conversion..............
 

sassyrel

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I took the cover off of mine today for a look-see......
Still had quite a bit of gear oil in it (and boy did it smell good!), although there was definitely a good spray coming off of the pinion and coating the whole underside of the truck. I can also see a bunch of splatter radiating out across the wheel/tires. So it looks like it had enough fluid in it, but it got so hot it expanded and gushed out of every orifice it could find. The bearings all appear to be in decent shape, the gears are another story. All the spider gears can just rattle around freely in the center section. The ring gear has a bunch of metal rolled up on the edges of all of the teeth. There's about 1/2" of sludge in the bottom of the case that used to be solid metal. I was able to rotate the pinion almost 45* back and forth. Think that's enough lash on the ring and pinion?

Bunch of metal filings, smells like death, excessive play on the ring and pinion.....as the truck's official coroner I'm forced to declare this poor rear axle DOA.

On the hunt for a new Sterling 10.25"

Maybe now's a good time for a dually conversion..............

check out www.car-part.com for a used axle in your area.. near all of them,,tell if they are posi or not also...
 

KyleQ

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Another point is that the Sterlings have that odd racheting nut setup on the wheel bearings so you need the 2 prong socket to work on them. D70s are just a big hex, and you *could* take them off with a hammer and punch if you had to.

I like the D70 simply because of the smooth center section being nicer for offroading. Brakes are a PIA, yes, but the fix to that is rear discs.... someday.

I think that really, either one will work fine on these trucks.


Warning - this information amy be been gleamed off of Pirate 4x4, or I may have found this out on my own...

Those selt locking ratchet syle are liked by many, and disliked by the same amount. The spindle nuts for the D70, D60, Sterling 10.25 and 14B are all the same - so you can get the hex style with the little keeper that sits in the spindle grove if you like.

My comment was warranted as he added nothing to the thread, only cluttered it up. I've posted references from other sites when posting data like that, and it was Pirate in that case too, but I just didn't remember to do so when i'm on a quick break from work. Nobody is perfect - you could have kept the thread much more organized by simply sending me a PM and I could have just edited the post.


Beyond that -

Here is a D70 with disk brakes - K20 front calipers and E350 rotors with custom studs.
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With brakes on and painted-
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Here is a D70U - notice how nice a smooth it is, perfect for wheeling.
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I still like the Dana axles over the Sterling due to the availability of parts and the cheaper cost. I thrashed an inner wheel bearing on my steer D60 and was able to grab a wheel bearing from my spare D70 hub and get on the trail for a cost of zero.
 

bike-maker

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Bought a new (used) Sterling this morning.
$200 at a junkyard about 1 mile from my house.
It's out of a 94 - so it's the better pinion setup which I was after since that appears to be what killed mine.
Axle code on the truck is C5; which I believe is 4.10 gears and posi.
I'll pick it up tomorrow morning. They still have to tear it out of the truck for me.
 

SparkandFire

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Very good deal on that!

;Sweet

Glad to hear you found one! I think C5 axle is 4.10 Open (which is what my blue truck is) but I might be mistaken?

In any event, that's a good score!
 

KyleQ

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Decent deal - it would be a great deal if it did have a l/s carrier in it. The longer pinions are a better setup, I know when I had just gotten my truck the pinion was very loose. My buddy pulled with this truck and he was a Chevy guy, so I'm sure he had a little less respect for it than normal and he was pulling some big trailers around with it. I had the truck on a drive on lift and went to grab the drive shaft to swing under it and it moved a bunch. I ended up just tightening down the pinion nut, peening it a little bit and putting paint on it.

I would highly suggest folks get a paint pen and draw a line across their pinions so you can see if the nut is backing off. It is fairly common for the Sterlings to do that, which can result in trashed bearings or as bad a a R&P.


I'm not sure I would want to ditch the rear drum setup for disks - I did it for 4x4 reasons. The factory drum brakes are HUGE and they have quite a bit more stopping power than the disks do, I wouldn't put rear disks on a tow rig unless you could replicate the same rotor size/diameter and caliper size as another similarly sized truck.
 

Dave 001

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An axle code with a letter and a number has a limited slip differential. An axle code with (2) numbers is an open differential. According to my '88 factory repair manual, C5 is a 6250 lbs capacity axle with 4.10 gears and limited slip.

Dave
 

subway

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Sorry to hi-jack but can you tell me what I have in my truck Dave, I don't think a semi-float came in my crew cab stock. Axle code reads.
V1060
3.55 .10 2 9F12
Thanks
 

bike-maker

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Limited slip would be a nice bonus, but I'm used to the peg leg that was in there, I'll find out when I pick it up tomorrow AM.
Either way, I got a good deal because I found it within a mile of my house - and I have to use my truck with the mangled rear end in it to get it home. I put the cover back on the old rear end and put some fresh gear oil in her. Took her for a drive around the block and man, there's some bad sounds coming from that rear end. Strange thing is the normal rattle from the Lucky modded flywheel has turned into a chatter that continues clear up past 1500 rpm under load. Worst case scenario; I'll pull the rear drive line and just lock the hubs in.

Subway, if it came from the factory with a diesel, it has a full float rear end in it.
And any crew cab would be a F350, which would also have a full float rear.

Unless somebody swapped to a different rear end.......
 

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