Shop near Yuma AZ? bad water pump

Black dawg said:

For many years just used the big wrench pictured and wacked it with a hammer. If you leave the belt on, most of the time you wont need to find a way to hold the pulley.

But if you have access to compressed air and a real air hammer, that is the way ....

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+1... I just use a very large metric adjustable wrench and a good hunk of hardwood. Couple of whacks and its done.

mblaney said:

+1... I just use a very large metric adjustable wrench and a good hunk of hardwood. Couple of whacks and its done.

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The fan clutch on the van pretty easily backed off with just the wrench, belts still on. I snugged it back because I'm not really ready to change it, and I'm not driving it any anyway right now until I replace the pump.

KansasIDI said:

I have one of those. And I can’t get my engine up to temp… with a tested OEM Motorcraft thermostat, the flow cooler might be part of the equation. I also have way too big of a radiator. But nonetheless, I highly recommend that water pump.

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Yes, I saw those. Might have been good on the RV, not sure it's needed on the van. I'll see how the eBay one looks when I pick it up from my mail place on Tuesday. I could still send it back but odds are I'll be using it, unless it has obvious flaws/damage.

Got the $27 eBay water pump. Looks to actually be either a Gates 44018 ($36, at 56% off, on Amazon) or a Dayco DP1012 ($54 on RockAuto) based on the gasket. Both have a different gasket cut vs others, and they both have allen key type plugs. I'm thinking it's probably the Gates based on the look of the "fan" on the back side, and silver hardware instead of gold like Dayco has. It didn't come with the Murray box shown in the ad.

Probably still fine. It doesn't feel like it has bearing slop, and it's still in the original factory sealed bag. The bag is in rough shape, but not the pump itself. It looks ok. No corrosion like it might have from damp conditions.

I'll think on it a few days and look it over again closer to be sure it's not damaged before I open the bag.

Will this work for sealing the top two and bottom two bolt threads?

It should work fine. I use regular black RTV and have never had a problem.

I know a guy in flagstaff that I trust, has a shop and would likely let you do it there, but that's not close to yuma.

I know this doesn't help, but I've got the pneumatic hammer type clutch tool. I'll never use the wrenches again. Makes it way too easy. Good to hear you got it lose. Some can be a nightmare, especially if someone used red loctite instead of tightening it correctly.

My order for pump choice
1. Motorcraft/International - direct from dealer, to many scams out there anymore to trust ebay/amazon
2. flowkooler - still made in usa last I checked
3. whatever parts store has the best warranty

I like rightstuff 90 minute gray for waterpumps. Being it's rigid(machined casting) permatex told me gray was the ticket, and that black was for stamped steel covers(oil pans, valve covers, etc.). Truth be told, both will likely seal without issue.

Snapped some pics of it today. The pump is mildly stiff to turn, as in you can't flick the impeller with your finger and make it turn more than about 1/3 turn at most. I'm guessing that's normal?





I made the "installation guide pins" (long bolts with the heads cut off and the ends filed down to be smooth). It might be next week before I try to tackle the job. The Four Seasons fan clutch was delivered today, so I'll go pick it up tomorrow.

A little stiff, but pretty close to the FlowKooler I ordered. 3/4 turn if spun

I know it's gonna be a bit different for a van, but how many feet of heater hose is usually called for?

I can't remember what the RV used, considering it was 5 years ago. I seem to recall getting just about exactly the right amount.

I plan to delete/bypass the connections to the rear heater core, so I can save a good bit on hose there.

Ok this is odd. O'Reilly's is showing me weird hoses that are 5/8 at one end and 3/4 at the other plus normal 5/8 hose. They want stupid prices for the hoses, $24-42 per hose:


---
Molded Heater Hose Pipe To Thermostat; Cut To Length
End 1 Inside Diameter (in): 5/8 Inch
End 2 Inside Diameter (in): 3/4 Inch
--
Molded Heater Hose Heater To Pipe; Cut To Length
End 1 Inside Diameter (in): 5/8 Inch
End 2 Inside Diameter (in): 3/4 Inch
--
Molded Heater Hose Heater To Engine; Without Auxiliary Heater; Cut To Length; 90 Degree
End 1 Inside Diameter (in): 5/8 Inch
End 2 Inside Diameter (in): 5/8 Inch

Edit: ok now i see why ... Ford put 3/4 barbs on this '89 heater core instead of 5/8 like the '85 RV had, at least according to replacement heater cores. I'll probably just get a couple of 5/8 to 3/8 reducers and 1ft of 3/4 to adapt normal 5/8 hose.

But i don't understand why it calls for 3:

1: Pipe To Thermostat (5/8 - 3/4)
2: Heater To Pipe (5/8 - 3/4)
3: Heater To Engine (5/8 - 5/8)

part of it is 3/4 heater core is for "w/ AC" so maybe #3 is just unused for me? Not sure what "pipe" it's referring to and why one is marked thermostat.

Since I plan to delete rear, I should just need:

1: 5/8 from water pump top barb to 3/4 heater core (via reducer)
2: 5/8 from passenger side engine barb to 3/4 heater core (via reducer)

Or am I missing something?

Cubey said:

1: Pipe To Thermostat (5/8 - 3/4)

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Cubey said:

part of it is 3/4 heater core is for "w/ AC" so maybe #3 is just unused for me? Not sure what "pipe" it's referring to and why one is marked thermostat.

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Since none of our engines have a heater hose that goes to the thermostat, I'm betting that the listing is for a van with a gas engine. Those did have a hose that ran between a fitting on the water pump (I believe) and the thermostat housing from what I've seen. I don't know about the 300-6, 351M, or the 400, but the Windsor engines have a molded 90* hose there while the 460's used a straight piece of hose there. Make sure that this listing is for a IDI. If not, maybe try again or try another site.

IDIBRONCO said:

Since none of our engines have a heater hose that goes to the thermostat, I'm betting that the listing is for a van with a gas engine. Those did have a hose that ran between a fitting on the water pump (I believe) and the thermostat housing from what I've seen. I don't know about the 300-6, 351M, or the 400, but the Windsor engines have a molded 90* hose there while the 460's used a straight piece of hose there. Make sure that this listing is for a IDI. If not, maybe try again or try another site.

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RockAuto is showing them too, so I dunno.

I think "thermostat" means the water pump connection, and "pipe" refers to the steel lines leading to the ear heater core. But it's so vague.

The ACDelco & Gates by-the-foot hoses says pipe to water pump, with aux heater, so presumably it runs back there first... but then the other Gates says pipe to thermostat.

Maybe "thermostat" is referring to the heater control valve? Because there's also a long "pipe to heater" hose that's also 5/8-3/4 (not pictured).

I need to dig out my Chilton Econoline book tomorrow and see if it might shed some light on this.

But I'm guessing I just need to rip it all out and run it from pump to core, and from core to engine (with the heater valve in between), the stock heater hose routing. That's what I did on the RV since it had no rear/aux heater, and that's how the old hoses were routed.

Looks like 5-6ft of hose is probably all I need, since the heater core is so close to the water pump and engine on vans. Might be worth taking them off ahead of time and measuring them so I don't waste money buying 1-2ft of extra hose that'll be too short to use for anything, at the $3/ft retail price. Maybe i can get a tape measure fished in to measure with them installed though.

Here's a crappy diagram I drew up on my phone just now. This should be the stock setup, I think. So everything is 5/8" except the front heater core, based on replacements for an 89 that had A/C. Rear aux replacement cores say 5/8".

I guess Ford engineers didn't like everything using universal 5/8" hose so they changed it to 3/4" only on the front core, as if that makes any sense. Vans that didn't get AC still got 5/8" cores.




Oh and looking back at a picture of the rear of the engine, it has two very obvious heater hoses running right over the engine. So I should just be able to delete those from where ever they're going up front at the water pump, core, and/or engine.

Cubey said:

I guess Ford engineers didn't like everything using universal 5/8" hose so they changed it to 3/4" only on the front core, as if that makes any sense. Vans that didn't get AC still got 5/8" cores.

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Ford definitely likes to use some interesting hose setups.

James

@Cubey I’m late to the party, and everyone please correct me where I’m wrong.....

The top of the water pump in Cubey’s photo has 2 aux ports that are plugged.

On my ‘92 van, one port goes to the rear HC and then to the back of the LH head. The 2nd port goes to the front HC and to the RH head. Would this routing aid in cooling water flow through the heads?

Cubey, under the rear hoses in your photo there is prolly a plug right there....