zf5 clutch

[punkmechanic]

I think Im in need of a new clutch and I want to ditch the dual mass flywheel that is currently making noise and apparently giving me drivabilty issues.

I know that luk makes a conversion but it is 500 to 750 depending on where you get if from and thats too steep for me at the moment, has anyone used a velao? (probably spelled wrong, I have heard of them and was told they make a single mass flywheel kit for the 6.9s).

the background on all of this is as follows for anyone that cares: I drove down to bend this last weekend (just over 150 miles one way up and down mountains and hills). I noticed about 50 miles in that when cruising at 65 mph my rpms in fifth are at 2200 ( a bit fast and high on revs but I'm running wmo so I dont really worry too much about mpg's). I noticed that if I lifted off the throttle to decel without pushing the clutch in that the truck felt like it was missing a little. After another 50 to 75 miles it REALLY felt like it was missing, like it wasnt hitting at all for a complete revolution, but only if on decel at 2000-2200 rpm, then it would straighten out. If i gave it throttle it would straighten up, or if I hit the clutch it would drop revs and idle normal. I thought it was the pump (and towcat thinks it is too), but I asked one of the old techs at work and he said its probably the dual mass. He said it was common for them to bind at certain rpms once they started wearing out. So I checke the free play (its supposed to be no more than 1 inch, and its almost 2!!!)

So now Im trying to determine what exactly is going on and how to fix it without going ass up broke.

thanks,
punk

 

[towcat]

that tech at your work is why I was his boss when I worked at a dealership.
Ford, GM and Dodge won't warranty a dual mass anymore until all potential fuel system issues are dealt with. Any imbalance in the firing pulses will cause havoc on the dual mass. this is one area you can't jump from one conclusion to another without addressing core issues.

 

[Cheaper Jeeper]

Check out the info in this post http://www.oilburners.net/forums/showthread.php?t=16973&page=2

With the parts from Autozone I listed there, and a 6.9 SMF from PartsAmerica (http://www.partsamerica.com/productdetail.aspx?MfrCode=SFW&MfrPartNumber=721&PartType=267&PTSet=A) for $175 (if you have no core) you can put together your own SMF kit for around $360...

 

[RLDSL]

Listen to towcat..and your gut.
I was getting all kinds of racket from the dual mass flywheel after my rebuild ( sounded like it was coming through the floorboard ) and I heard the chorus of " get the LUK" but it didn't make any sense, because I had no flywheel noise before the engine rebuild.
Turned out that 2 very slightly leaking injector lines were enough to throw the timing out of balance enough to make a flywheel dance. All it took was loosening and cranking them down a couple of times till they quit leaking and no more rattle

People are way too quick to condemn these flywheels.

 

[punkmechanic]

my gut says it's both. No idea when the fuel system was last gone through if ever and the dual mass was used when I got it. Have to pick my battles though as the budget won't hold new clutch, ip, and injectors.

 

[Agnem]

As economically minded as this group tends to be... I still can't figure why the Lucky Mod hasn't taken off. Cheap, easy and works great. Why spend hundreds when $10 in bolts and a few hours of time will yeild a perfectly usable SMF. Night Moose is getting one, so I'll be able to say I've done it twice sucessfully.

 

[lotzagoodstuff]

As economically minded as this group tends to be... I still can't figure why the Lucky Mod hasn't taken off. Cheap, easy and works great. Why spend hundreds when $10 in bolts and a few hours of time will yeild a perfectly usable SMF. Night Moose is getting one, so I'll be able to say I've done it twice sucessfully.

I think you've got me convinced Mel. I bought the Fort Wayne kevlar upgrade clutch and pressure plate kit ($117 shipped to my door), I am going to spend the extra dough on the kevlar pilot bushing, Lucky Mod my DMF, over fill the trans/turn up the idle and have what I think will be a relatively bullet proof set up for around $150.

 

[Agnem]

Cool. I'll try to take some pics of the one I'm doing now to help anybody else who wants to do it. Our article unfortunately lacks the pictures.

 

[lotzagoodstuff]

As usual Mel: you da man!

Pics would be great, I actually have a spare flywheel so I was planning on modding that one so I could do the job all at once but I was hoping somebody would post pics to remove all doubt.

Thanks again

R. J.

 

[Cheaper Jeeper]

Cool. I'll try to take some pics of the one I'm doing now to help anybody else who wants to do it. Our article unfortunately lacks the pictures.

I wouldn't mind seeing those pictures myself. I have a couple of DMFs, one of which I KNOW is bad, and if I hadn't already had a good SMF on my truck, I would have probably done the Lucky Mod myself.

Once you've modded the DMF, I assume it is no problem to get it resurfaced - though I've read that a lot of places won't resurface them when they are still a functioning DMF.

Speaking of pictures, just in case anyone was interested (punkmechanic) and missed it in the thread I linked, I have a bunch of pictures in my gallery comparing the SMF and DMF components and the T-19 vs ZF-5 dimensions.

Hey, lotzagoodstuff, that Fort Wayne clutch kit sounds like a really good deal. I'm assuming it is a kit made for the DMF, but does the disk have springs in the hub?

 

[RLDSL]

I bought one of those Ft wayne rebuilt clutch kits last year and got the kevlar lined, and it wasthe sprung center disc. those can be used either DMF or SMF, but the solid center disc can only be used DMF. I got mine with the kevlar pilot bushing as well.
the setup works great towing heavy. tame on the knee , smooth in traffic.

 

[Cheaper Jeeper]

Either of you guys know if the disc can be purchased separately?

 

[RLDSL]

Either of you guys know if the disc can be purchased separately?

I would imaging you could, or you could send them your disc and have them reline it. they do all the work in house, unless you wanted one of the discs with the springs, then give them a call, I'd bet they have plenty of odd discs to make up from core sets that the pressure plates get culled
Ft Wayne Clutch Those folks are really helpful . Can't say enough good