First tow, and she ran hot - who has improved cooling system?

[sle2115]

That may be true with certain parts, but there is still a quality difference in a lot of stuff that I can see and feel. Sure, Ford doesn't make oil filters. We've known that all along, and I'm sure a ton of other parts they don't make too. BUT, I DO believe that what they get from their sources is better in a lot of ways and from a business sense, it is logical. No doubt there are quality agreements with their suppliers that have to be met. Ford dealers are still servicing these trucks (even if they don't know what they are doing in a lot of cases, and maybe don't even like working on them), and Ford service still comes with a warranty, so if the parts are crappy, it costs everybody in the end, so there is a much higher standard of quality. Case in point - a water pump. Since Towcat specifically mentioned it, so will I. When I did a water pump for Landscapeman, he bought a NAPA Gold pump, and I got a Motorcraft one. The Napa part was like $40 and was their best one. The Ford pump was at least twice that much, but with my discount was around $60. We set the two side by side, and examined them. The Ford pump had a cleaner casting, and the bolt hole shoulders were machined, so that the bolt would sit square over the hole and tighten evenly. On the inside, the Ford pump had an impeller that was pressed fully onto the shaft. The end of the shaft was even with the outer surface of the impeller. The Napa pump on the other hand, did not have a machined casting, there was casting flash, and the impeller looked like it might fall off at any given moment. Even Charlie insisted that we use the Ford pump, even though he knew it would mean going to the effort of returning the Napa one, and paying more. This is a simple example of why I only buy Ford parts. You guys in the parts business, can buy what you want, and save lots of money, while I, in my blissfull ignorance, will continue to trust Ford until I can't get their stuff anymore (which is happening more and more... the latest victim, certain V belts for 6.9's), and when Ford is gone, I'll be able to sleep with a clear concious knowing I did what I could to keep them afloat.

You do realize you may not have been comparing apples to apples right? You were possibly comparing a rebuilt/remanufactured to new. Just so you know. Look at an aftermarket NEW Carter water pump. Sit them side by side. Oh and by the way, my father was forced to retire by Ford moving their contracts out of the states, 35 years and never used one sick day, so I don't have any loyalty to Ford at all.

 

[RLDSL]

If you want to go nuts on a radiator, I had emailed these folks for a price on an all aluminum 5 row equivilant radiator for my '92 a couple of months back and he said he could make one for around $550 http://www.rodneyred.com/

----------Robert

 

[sle2115]

We used a company called BeCool for our aluminum radiators. Not sure what apps they have for these trucks, but they make a very nice product and they were always price competitive. We had them make one for a 78 Vega with a big block that we drag raced, don't remember the cost, but I remember it was suprisingly much lower than we thought. Not sure if they even do custom work these days, but they make V8 drop in radiators for like S10's, Ford Rangers and such.

 

[Mojave Red]

Jim73

I've been fighting high temps for years since rebuilding my engine and adding a turbo. I'm located at Ft Irwin (Barstow area) so I'm no stranger to triple digit temps. I just got back from a weeks fishing in the E. Sierras (June Lake Loop+Mammoth Lakes areas). Outside temps were hovering around 100-103 in the Owens Valley. My truck averaged 215-220 for most of the trip with an occasional bump to 230 - never over heated though... Like you, I will go the big radiator route as I'm not comfortable running over 210. I had to slow way down on the grades. Let me add that I had my 10' camper in back. I've tried all the trick (MS Tech fan, timing, three t-stats, etc...), but I think the only solution is a new rad.
It seem something goes wrong every time I venture out on one of my big trips. This time temps were the least of my problems. I'm pretty sure I fried my transmission. It got me there and back but I think it's at the end of its rope. The story is worth its own thread so I'll post the details later.

I've got fan wrench, and even a new NAPA fan clutch, so let me know if you need either one.

More later, Brian

 

[Jim73]

sle2115, I actually checked BeCool to see if they made a drop-in radiator for the F-250 IDI - no such luck. I'd used one of theirs on my previous truck with excellent results.

Robert, that's intriguing - but like I said, money is tight. At this point, I'm getting deeper and deeper in parts investment at a low cashflow time of year for me - but it doesn't make much sense to me to NOT do the water pump, thermostat, belts and hoses while I'm into the cooling system... 'course I've got to pull the block drains (that ought to be fun - hope Aerokroil will loosen 'em up!), and remember to flush the heater core after I get the block passages as clean as I can. Hmmm - guess the starter will need to come out to get the drain plug on that side, huh?

Still waiting to see if the Heatex solution winds up being affordable for me right now. Just to make it more interesting, my parts buddy is dangling a new 4 row that he swears is absolutely OEM quality at a very attractive price involving beer and help with a home project! With all the other stuff I'm now doing, swapping a radiator is sounding like a lark and I may take him up on it just to get going and test the new configuration. I live near the base of a pretty substantial grade and if everything works right there, I'd be fairly confident taking the truck and trailer north up to Oregon in a few weeks.

And gents, I want to thank all of you for your knowledge, advice, and thoughts.

 

[f-two-fiddy]

I've been watching this thread, as I'm in need of more cooling also.

It's hard to believe there is no readily available, extra cooling rad out there. I've looked and haven't had any luck. There are thousands of these trucks out there with aftermarket turbo's, that are all in the same boat.

Has anyone investigated the 94 IDI turbo. I wonder if Ford mounted a different rad for it?
Where are peeps getting their 4-5 core rads? If there's a shop out there that has done a few, they've got experience with this rad, and prolly have better luck getting things right?

 

[sle2115]

Just to make it more interesting, my parts buddy is dangling a new 4 row that he swears is absolutely OEM quality at a very attractive price involving beer and help with a home project! With all the other stuff I'm now doing, swapping a radiator is sounding like a lark and I may take him up on it just to get going and test the new configuration.

I would in a heart beat! What have you got to lose? Do the water pump and such, flush it out and put that one in. Worst case scenario, you would have to drain and purchase or install the Heatex one, this would be a non-decision for me, pending the home project wasn't too much...

I have the stock radiator in mine, but I do not have air. The radiator was actually out of an 85 F350 (built one truck from two) but was the exact radiator that was in my 87 as far as size. At any rate, I run very comfortable temps, almost always under 195 and I would wonder if your current radiator has problems like plugged/corroded tubes etc. So I say if the home project is doable, jump on that deal!

 

[towcat]

here's a suggestion for a "poor man's cooling system cocktail".....
I've checked my parts books and the OBS psd radiators are the same as ours dimensionally. the mountings are slightly different though. I don't mind the de-gas bottles, but I am opting for one out of a mid-80's BMW since those still use the radiators caps we are currently using. Big plus for me since I am ardent on running a 7lb cap. Just some foor for thought. Oh yea, all the parts new came out under $250.

 

[Jim73]

Mulling fixes

Mojave Red, thank you! Between Robert and Brian, seems I can get a fan tool. That's awesome - once again, I have to tell all of you guys how much it means to me to have a group of people who help so readily with information and experiences that I lack with these trucks. And then you find guys who are fairly close willing to help with tools! Man, the internet is amazing, as are the Oilburner members!

Still think the eventual solution is something more capable than stock, but the Heatex retailer n San Diego isn't very responsive. I can wait until after the holiday weekend, since I understand what it's like on Friday in a shop whose people are all trying to get out the door. But I am considering the new stocker and running the test, since I have only time to lose. If it doesn't work well enough, I can move on to one of these other solutions - but I might be able to save money at a time when that would be a good thing...

Jim

 

[sle2115]

Big plus for me since I am ardent on running a 7lb cap.

May I ask why? Just wondering, I prefer higher pressure for increased boil point, but usually just go stock (not higher) with many years/miles of good results. I am assuming you want to reduce pressure on cooling system, but thought I would ask to be sure.

 

[MIDNIGHT RIDER]

I am looking at most of you guys year models/engines and I must conclude that they must have used a couple of different radiators in these trucks.

My 1985 original radiator is 4-core and HUGE.

There is no way anything thicker, wider, or taller is going to fit between my fenders.

Advance has a four-core that measures and looks identical for $350.

Ready Rad brand, I think.

Like I stated before, there ain't a truck that has been worked harder than mine, not a brag, but a fact.

I have never been close to overheating with my old 6.9, Hypermax, high-fuel, and all.

The Cummins, with the same old, almost corroded over, radiator runs even cooler than the 6.9 did.

I know this sounds awful; but, I changed the bottom hose when the truck was nineteen years old, and it wasn't leaking then.

I don't see how a larger radiator could be had than my original.

Did they use a smaller radiator on some of these trucks??

Thanks.

 

[ClassicIDI]

I also would like to know why you feel a 7lb cap is an good thing. My truck has one on it and think its really hurting the cooling system. Last time I towed a load up a fairly good grade the truck heated up to 230 and that 7lb cap was blowing antifreeze out at around 220, I know cause thats when I started to smell antifreeze and later after I was looking the truck over I noticed that the radiator had that dried green antifreeze residue all over the top of it by the cap. I am soon going the replace the cap, thermostat, belts, hoses, and antifeeze with factory parts and fleetrite antifreeze in hopes that mabey this will help my problem.

 

[MIDNIGHT RIDER]

I am soon going the replace the cap.

I had a weird issue with my radiator holding pressure, even after days of sitting.

Loosen the cap and get an anti-freeze bath.

This situation followed me through an entire engine change to an entirely different make of engine.

I replaced my cap with a 13 pound cap with a release lever.

Now, I pull the lever, letting the pressure spray down in the overflow jug.

No more anti-freeze baths.

 

[Diesel JD]

Its hard to argue with Calvin whos' put so many trouble free miles on several IDIs, but I would have thought that a 7lb cap would cause cavitation? This is what I've read other places. As far as cooling goes, I haven't had much cooling trouble except with the AC on full blast at high speeds or idling in traffic. My last long pull it was 98-100*F ambient temperature and the truck would go up to about 220-225 and then teh fan clutch would kick in and bring the temp down to 195-205. On the way back from teh coast it rained and I couldn't hit 200 if I tried even with teh AC on full blast cause it ahd cooled down a bunch. I am planning on a hypermax this summer so I hope that doesn't make her overheat, but if it does I guess I will be addinga Travis style radiator or at least an MS-Tech clutch. Jim, replacing the water pump and T-stat might be good PM but the t-sat housing, i can't see why it would need replacement as long as the check ball is working correctly. I can'tt ell you exactly how that is checked, but I would advise checking teh t-stat in a pot of water to see if it opens and closes right before installing cause you ahev to take the alt. fuel filter mount, top rad. hose and t-stat housing loose to get at the thermostat. You can also probably get away with just pulling the easy block drain behind the oil cooler and then backflush the block and heater core with that prestone flush kit or similar until the water comes out clean and then call it good. That's whatI did.

 

[Jim73]

Hey icanfixall - check your ***...

I sent you a PM re clutch tool, but not sure the system is working - rough weekend for Oilburner's server, apparently.

JD, I guess I'm just trying to cover all bases since the labor is so significant. If the thermostat housing looks good, I can always return the new one - I'm blessed with a proper old-fashioned parts house in my neighborhood and have a good relationship with them. My inclination is to come as close as possible to "zero-timing" the cooling system as I can.

Hey guys, for those of you who have mounted a water temp gauge - where did you put your senders?

Jim