first Blackstone oil analysis--coolant or WVO?
- Thread starter mcbg
- Start date
Diesel JD
Full Access Member
Well that 1/4 gallon of coolant is going somewhere but it may not be to the crankcase oil. I've seen a lot of scary oil analysis come from WVO users, I just don't think it's very good for the engine. I burn biodiesel and have the same high potassium and sodium readings you do and have at times when my truck didn't burn or leak a drop of coolant anywhere. I don't have the high wear metals except i have had high lead probably from a particulate strike on the bearings as this has been over 4.5 years ago and I still have good oil pressure and no scary noises... it MUST not be excessive bearing wear I figure. As someone who's done a fair bit of research on veggie oil and biodiesel and made a bunch of bio, there are lots of bad things in WVO otherwise they wouldn't be tossing it. No one has ever answered to my satisfaction what the free fatty acids in the waste oil might be doing to the engine or fuel system components. The coolant leak is probably just a low pressure leak from a hose connection, if it were a head gasket or a cracked block it would be downing that coolant at an alarming rate even an external leak soon becomes noticeable on your driveway long before in your oil analysis. Long story short, I'm voting for veggie oil being the culprit. Only you can decide if this free or cheap fuel is worth the extra wear you can see with your own eyes. Biodiesel is a better fuel if made properly but more expensive and a lot more work, buying pump fuel is getting screwed I'm done with that! Good luck to you whatever you decide.
PwrSmoke
Full Access Member
That's analarming report alright. I have heard the same things Diesel JD has mentioned about WVO and bio, but have not experienced them personally because I don't use either fuel. Job one is to change the oil ASAP. I have an '86 with just a few more miles than yours and on it's last UOA on R-T 15W40 with 5,302 miles on the oil, below are the numbers for comparison. I think I'd listen to Diesel JD on this one and maybe back off n the WVO for your engine's sake. Compare to the universal averages on your sheet.
(amounts in PPM, all other elements 0)
Shell Rotella-T 15W40 CJ-4
Mi on unit- 134,502
Mi on oil- 5,302
TBN- 9.9
Flashpoint- 405
fuel- 1%
Viscosity 86.8 SUS
Insolubles- 0.4%
Aluminum- 4
Chromium- 4
Iron- 46
Copper- 2
Lead- 4
Moly- 4
Potassium- 3
Boron- 2
Silicon- 5
Sodium- 5
Calcium- 4059
Magnesium- 11
Phosphorus- 1121
Zinc- 1378
(amounts in PPM, all other elements 0)
Shell Rotella-T 15W40 CJ-4
Mi on unit- 134,502
Mi on oil- 5,302
TBN- 9.9
Flashpoint- 405
fuel- 1%
Viscosity 86.8 SUS
Insolubles- 0.4%
Aluminum- 4
Chromium- 4
Iron- 46
Copper- 2
Lead- 4
Moly- 4
Potassium- 3
Boron- 2
Silicon- 5
Sodium- 5
Calcium- 4059
Magnesium- 11
Phosphorus- 1121
Zinc- 1378
h2odrx
Anti-O
WVO might be the cause but do like they say and test in 1500, cause the more info you get the better they can tell you what is going on.
Diesel JD
Full Access Member
Also don't let it scare you too much. I've heard of engines with great blackstone reports committing suicide not long after and then a lot of folks like me have had consistently sketchy reports and still running strong. That WVO is bad news especially if: You're truck is driven only relatively short distances and not worked very hard. WVO is a lot less combustible than diesel or B100 so low EGTs= poor burn, injector and ring coking, washing down the rings....bad bad bad. Or if, your wvo is high in FFA, by high I mean anything beyond say a 1-2 NaOH titration, even that is 1.4-2.8% FFA by weight roughly. If there's one good thing that has come out of the environmental movement and getting the sulfur out of our fuel from the engine's perspective it has to be less sulfur to react with combustion products= less H2SO4 in the crankcase to attack the bearings. WVO introduces another acid albeit a much weaker one, into the crankcase. It's conjecture on my part so I need to look into it some more, I just have seen some scary reports with WVO engines, and after experimenting with small amounts of wvo and seeing my lead jump from 9ppm to 103 in one change I said nope, I'm done with this. One more thing, 5300 miles is a lot to put on dino oil unless you have a bypass filter. 3 quarts of make up oil and it isn't terrible though.
I'd see what the trend is first. Like they suggest.....send another sample and see what is changing. But, using coolant is not a good thing. If you are having the same loss regardless of mileage, it may simply be a leak in the rad or hose that will always keep coolant 1/4 gallon low and you're just fine. And, it sounds like that's the case. If you were consuming coolant in the motor, you really should see a linear loss with increased mileage.
Heath
Heath
Last edited:
Diesel JD
Full Access Member
I feel pretty confident its a slow leak. One place to check is the top seam of the radiator tank. I had a <1 year old Modine crack there right before Thanksgiving break in 04. Luckily the company I bought the rad from gave me a free replacement, no questions asked and let me change it right there in their parking lot. Another common slow coolant loss point is the hoses and hose clamps, also the heater hoses, water pump and heater core. You could watch for a trend but that WVO is very poor fuel as is and could be turned into excellent fuel with just a little effort.
funnyman06
Full Access Member
I run a 5000 mile interchange on my Dino oil all the time... I use Valvoline 15/40 Diesel oil. Oil pressure is always good, comes out black as night.
Diesel JD
Full Access Member
You're right it's not overly long. My has a fair amount of blowby and the oil just looks ready to be changed by 2500-3500 miles.
k_williams1982
'01 Excursion 4x4
I change mine every 3,000 miles. The oil fill neck says that the intervals are 5,000 miles, but that seems like a long time to me. I tried using Castrol Tectron 15W40, but the truck seemed to "burn" some (about 1/4 quart every 500 miles), so I switched to Delo 400 15W40 and haven't had any "burning" issues. I was using a Fram oil filter with the Castrol and I am using a Motorcraft FL1995 filter now with the Delo, but I don't think that has anything to do with the change in oil consumption.
Diesel JD
Full Access Member
Nothing....other than the fact that it now has to burn 2 quarts to be 1 quart low on the dipstick. The 5000 interval is what the owners manual recommends for "normal" service, mine sees a lot of stop/go driving and heat cycles since it's a daily driver, also it gets very dirty and dusty some of the places I drive when it's dry around here. Hence I err closer to the severe service deal. I think using the Delo will preserve your truck longer than the Castrol. They make great gas engine oil but from what I read the diesel rated stuff leaves a bit to be desired.
PwrSmoke
Full Access Member
Diesel JD: That was my '86 at 5300 mile OCI, not the OP with the poor report who went only 3K miles. BTW, we seem to have the same truck. Both '86s, both with non-wastegated turbos... though mine is a 1st gen Banks (I installed it in '87). Mine still has a C-6.
I have used 5K miles as an OCI for a long time based on UOAs. As you can see by the report, it was just starting to thicken and the insolubles were at 0.4%. It's a "drat" moment because the oil TBN is always high (at 9.9 in this case) meaning it still has plenty of additive left. Some people say the dispersants will keep the soot from clumping but I'm just leery of running the soot or insoluble numbers too high. I recently installed a Racor bypass system and we'll see how that brings the soot down. I'd like to use the oil up if at all possible. I ws about midway through the OCI when I installed it and took a "before" sample. Will take another in 1500 miles and again at 5000 miles to see where we are.
Thus far my old buddy doesn't have much blowby and only uses oil between changes if I do a lot of high speed or tow. Over the years, the secret I have discovered with these trucks is to keep the oil level between "add" and "full," which is two quarts. It would always burn that top quart off, even when the engine was new. Keep it at the midway point and add one quart only when it's at the add mark
I have used 5K miles as an OCI for a long time based on UOAs. As you can see by the report, it was just starting to thicken and the insolubles were at 0.4%. It's a "drat" moment because the oil TBN is always high (at 9.9 in this case) meaning it still has plenty of additive left. Some people say the dispersants will keep the soot from clumping but I'm just leery of running the soot or insoluble numbers too high. I recently installed a Racor bypass system and we'll see how that brings the soot down. I'd like to use the oil up if at all possible. I ws about midway through the OCI when I installed it and took a "before" sample. Will take another in 1500 miles and again at 5000 miles to see where we are.
Thus far my old buddy doesn't have much blowby and only uses oil between changes if I do a lot of high speed or tow. Over the years, the secret I have discovered with these trucks is to keep the oil level between "add" and "full," which is two quarts. It would always burn that top quart off, even when the engine was new. Keep it at the midway point and add one quart only when it's at the add mark
