Cummins VS 6.9?

[NapaBavarian]

My decisively indecisive nature is confusing me, I figured I'd use a 6.9 with a turbo and studs in my upcoming buildup, but I'm scratching my head about a Cummins, watt are the advantages? Does it really warrant spending another 2K? I know the 6.9 will get it done, but then I think I could have a Ford Cummins...hmmmmmmm, what to do?

 

[97idi]

the cummins will make big power much easier, they both last along time and with the cummins u usualy have some more room under the hood atleast on the sides of the motor, each cummins mill has more fuel capabilitys and multiple turbo setups.
the cummins will take alot more boost with out studs.
i do like the idis tho not to many people have them.

i guess the main ? is what r u putting it in?
trans?
and what fab skills do u have?

 

[jperecko]

Cummins will make more power but the question is if you are after that.

A mechanical Cummins will likely be slightly more reliable and cheaper to maintain in the long run as well... but will take a larger initial investment. Also some of that reliability goes out the window when and if you mod it.


The real question is what do you want the truck to be capable of and go from there. Obviously I chose the Cummins route but that does not mean that I would never consider an IDI for a certain type of truck. I wanted easy decent power, better parts availability and, as was mentioned already, more space in the bay for stuff like a compressor.

 

[NapaBavarian]

I'm looking for reasonable power, fuel economy, and reliability, it'll be an F350 4x4 used like a truck should, I don't want crazy breaking stuff power, perhaps 500-600# of torque.

With a 6.9 it'll have a zf5 and less power, Cummins would likely see an nv5600

 

[The Warden]

Does it really warrant spending another 2K?

Unless you can get the engine (and tranny, if you're going with an NV5600) for free, I think you'd be looking at considerably more than $2K extra.

I know I'm committing blasphemy by even saying this, but I've always been a Cummins fan...I've wanted a 6BT since before I got my driver's license, and it hadn't been for fate, I'd probably be driving a Dodge now. Unlike many, I admire the 6BT for it's longevity...I'm not a die-hard speed/"MORE POWER" addict A few months ago, I started seriously contemplating doing a swap....I even had/have a line on an engine that I could get for next to nothing (and I may still grab it and put the engine in storage). However, I then began researching everything....saw how expensive the adapters and whatnot were. With planning to put a 1st Gen 12 valve in front of the recently-rebuilt ZF5 that's in my truck now, I would be looking at about $2K just in "accessories. $700 for an adapter plate to mate the engine to the tranny, $500 for the engine mounts and various other things, and I think about another $500 for the clutch assembly...and, of course other "little" things that add up. I decided not to because, at this point in my life, I just plain can't justify putting out that kinda $$, particularly when the 6.9l I have now is running quite well.

Now, I'm not trying to say that the IDI's a piece of junk....they're great engines with a few issues (6.9l head gaskets, 7.3l cavitation, the fuel system, etc). Get the issues addressed and you have a stout engine...and probably for quite a bit less than the swap would cost you.

If you can fabricate everything yourself, you might be in better shape.

Just my $.02...some things to think about

 

[sassyrel]

darrin tosh bought a truck with one in it--so he had near zero cost in it--but thats not the typical scenario--

 

[fx4wannabe]

Its getting harder to come up with a 6bt cheap but they are out there. A friend of mine got one for $500 and put it in a Toyota cab truck of all things. The aftermarket is better for the Cummins no doubt and they will make way more power pretty cheap. Cummins in a Ford is the ultimate combo IMO and if I was building a truck from scratch putting in the Cummins is a no brainer.

 

[dyoung14]

a studded,turboed, intercooled, moose equiped idi will make great power and reliability

 

[MIDNIGHT RIDER]

In all honesty, it was far easier to mount the Cummins in my truck than it was to get the I-H out.

The extra space under the hood is un-believable.

Everything is WAY so much easier to access and maintain.

I think people over-complicate putting a Cummins in a truck.

They call it a "conversion", requiring all sorts of mysterious and magical store-bought goodies.

The only thing I paid money for was a pre-fabricated pair of engine mounts from a guy named Randy outside of Phoenix AZ, about $300 if memory serves; well worth it, because, we only picked the Cummins up ONE time, eased it down into the Ford, and EVERY bolt lined right in place.

I could have welded up the mounts myself, but we probably would have had to lift the engine in and out a few more times, whilst I tweaked the angles and bolt-holes.

I have nothing bad to say about my old IDI; it stood up and made my living for half-a-million miles and is still running strong, or as strong as an IDI is capable of running.

BUT, installing that Cummins was the best move I ever made, PERIOD.

I over-doubled my fuel mileage, easily doubled the power, and NOTHING leaks.

Everyone claimed that I would have to remove the front clip; all we did was to remove the hood and maybe the radiator; admittedly, it was close maneuvering, but nothing as difficult as removing and then re-installing the front fenders, etc.

I didn't even evacuate the A/C system; I flopped the compressor over on the left fender, hoses still attached, and when the engine was installed, swung the compressor into it's new bracketry, without losing the charge.

The transmission crossmember moved rearward one hole.

The Ford alternator pulley was a direct swap to the 8-rib that was on the Dodge/Cummins Nippon-Denso unit.

Etc.Etc.Etc.

 

[Black dawg]

500# of torque in an idi is breaking new ground, a 500# cummins is boring. do a dt360. a gut on powerstroke nation did one in a superduty, so the bell adapter is out there.

 

[Diesel JD]

I think one reason that you had such an easy go of it was that you completely swapped drivetrains. From what I know, the expense tends to happen with the adapter plates to say get a ZF or C6 to mount up to a Cummins. Either that or having to go out and buy a new or reman NV4500 or NV5600. If you can find a beat but running Dodge Cummins and swap the whole drivetrain I think anybody could have the easy swap you did. Of course Darrin Tosh was the easiest of all running into an already converted Ford-Cummins for fairly cheap. He was blessed and lucky. The Cummins does seem to get a few MPG better than the IDI. I really can't say for sure why that is but it is significant if you put lots of miles on the thing like Midnight Rider. If it's a DD or weekend warrior toy it probably is not that significant. It really depends. It seems like Darrin only gets mid to high teens with his Ford/Cummins whereas my friend that I mae biodiesel with gets 20+ with both his 12V Dodge trucks. I have heard of people getting that kind of mileage with the IDI but usually not woring it hard. The Cummins seems to get better economy when it's being worked too. It seems like argve was down to single digits with the Enterprise and his 5'er while the Cummins would get closer to 11-12 loaded like that and upper teens empty even with his driving style.

 

[Diesel JD]

I think one reason that you had such an easy go of it was that you completely swapped drivetrains. From what I know, the expense tends to happen with the adapter plates to say get a ZF or C6 to mount up to a Cummins. Either that or having to go out and buy a new or reman NV4500 or NV5600. If you can find a beat but running Dodge Cummins and swap the whole drivetrain I think anybody could have the easy swap you did. Of course Darrin Tosh was the easiest of all running into an already converted Ford-Cummins for fairly cheap. He was blessed and lucky. The Cummins does seem to get a few MPG better than the IDI. I really can't say for sure why that is but it is significant if you put lots of miles on the thing like Midnight Rider. If it's a DD or weekend warrior toy it probably is not that significant. It really depends. It seems like Darrin only gets mid to high teens with his Ford/Cummins whereas my friend that I mae biodiesel with gets 20+ with both his 12V Dodge trucks. I have heard of people getting that kind of mileage with the IDI but usually not woring it hard. The Cummins seems to get better economy when it's being worked too. It seems like argve was down to single digits with the Enterprise and his 5'er while the Cummins would get closer to 11-12 loaded like that and upper teens empty even with his driving style.

 

[dukedrummer89]

installing that Cummins was the best move I ever made, PERIOD.

x2

 

[dyoung14]

Cummaparts are just against my religion, i dont care if they will make 3000 hp i will always stick with my 175 hp 6.9/7.3 idi

 

[typ4]

I was going to put one in my truck originally, couldnt find one anywhere. Bought all the parts for the IDI got it machined and assembled and THE NEXT day found 2 96 6bt's
if you can keep a cummins below 2k rpm they get phenomenal mileage