I need some fresh ideas or.... I'm buying a new truck.

[tuckerd1]

I'll lick my wounds, deal with it, and start fresh.

By the way Calvin, what can you tell me about F650 "proloader" crew cab's, particularly, what engines to look for/stay away from? I've looked at some with Fuller 6 speeds and they have my a bit "*****" for a medium duty.

Heath

I looked at the medium duties also. Found a Freightliner w/Cat and 9spd Eaton in Wash. Good price, low miles and a expense paid trip out there to pick it up but talked myself out of it because it was extended cab and not CC.

 

[snicklas]

Or another option...... I know that you have another truck, as does your Dad. What about setting up one of these other truck to tow the 5er with.. and work on the CC. Doesn't cost anything.... and you don't hurt the CC.....

I know the black truck is tall, but could you run smaller tires for the time being and make it through.....

This is one big thing that steers me away from a 5er..... I can tow a TT with "anything" but a 5er has to have a pickup setup for a 5er...... Not to rain on your parade... just suggesting another option......

 

[TomA]

Leak down test

It was mentioned above, but I think that a compressed air check while monitoring the cooling system pressure is in order before you start tearing anything down. Based upon your symptoms, this will need to be done with the engine hot. A compression tester hose and adapters can be used to pressurize each cylinder while it is at TDC (or near BDC before the exhaust valve opens, which may require holding engine stationary which is easy with a manual trans).

A cooling system pressure tester fitted to the radiator cap opening monitor the pressure. The cylinder under test should be pressurized with shop air (100 - 150 lbs, exact value not critical) for several minutes while the cooling system pressure is monitored. If you really want to get ****, you can do the test both at TDC and near BDC, to isolate the cylinder walls to see if there is a pinhole or crack there.

This will be time-consuming, but it should identify which holes have the issue. To me this is time well spent, because so often once the engine is torn down, a visual inspection fails to reveal any problem.

I would definately do a leak down test before tearing into the engine. Plumb a pressure gauge into your test fitting and look for a cylinder that looses pressure, then see if you are getting bubbles into coolant.

Cat does not publish compression numbers for their engines, a compression check is not considered difinitive for a diesel engine. Only a leak down test will tell you what you need to know.

 

[Trying my best]

If a guy was to do a leak down test, do the valves have to be closed?

 

[mabc926]

If a guy was to do a leak down test, do the valves have to be closed?

Yes.

You would have to take the rocker arms off on the cylinder you're working on.

And you will also want to disconnect the batteries so while the pistons are moving the engine does not start.

 

[hesutton]

Heath... Are you able to run an F650 rig without issues like we have here in cali with the smog upgrades........
To recap... The engine runs fine with no load on it. Runss without an issue. Then you place a load on it and it pushes out coolant thru the overflow tank.....

No issues with commercial rigs here. Lots of them around, just not as many are low profile crew cabs. No, it misses when the engine is warm, pulling a load or not. When cool, it doen't miss. It only pukes coolant will pulling the camper at highway speeds, not driving it on city/back roads.

I was towing for AMR back in 2007 when the 6.0 was released in ambulances. no matter what anyone tried to spin the situation, I have a pic of the local heavy ford dealership with a AMR in every one of their repair bays. that fiasco cost AMR a whole bunch of city/county contracts that still reverberates to 2011 when AMR lost the county of santa clara contract. previous poor performance was heavily cited. there was politics involved too, but the avail units for response was the whipping boy.

I'm a friend of the Ambulance service director here in the county. He has had nothing but problems with the 6.0 trucks. He's buying Dmax Ambulances to replace them. He's heard "good things" about the 6.4 and 6.7 Ford ambulances, but he's scared to go back with Ford platform because of the 6.0.

Good Talking to you Heath, I feel your pain.

I have another suggestion for you, What about picking up a $6 or $7K Dually to get you through the rest of the camping season, put your truck back in the garage and get it fixed. Once it is back on the road, sell the Dually. At that price point it wont go down in value and you would probably get your money back out of it.

Makes sence to me, but Missy may be hard to sell that plan too.

I looked at the medium duties also. Found a Freightliner w/Cat and 9spd Eaton in Wash. Good price, low miles and a expense paid trip out there to pick it up but talked myself out of it because it was extended cab and not CC.

I really like the low profile crew cab F650's I've seen locally, espically with the Fuller trans!

Or another option...... I know that you have another truck, as does your Dad. What about setting up one of these other truck to tow the 5er with.. and work on the CC. Doesn't cost anything.... and you don't hurt the CC.....

I know the black truck is tall, but could you run smaller tires for the time being and make it through.....

This is one big thing that steers me away from a 5er..... I can tow a TT with "anything" but a 5er has to have a pickup setup for a 5er...... Not to rain on your parade... just suggesting another option......

Thought about that when the crew cab start acting like a jerk on my way to the Rally. The big problem is I need to haul the crew with me. With a single cab, we all won't fit.

Heath

 

[Knuckledragger]

Heath,

I have not read everything on the thread closely, so forgive me if this has already been suggested.

Coolant puke; some causes are: missing thermostat, thermostat stuck open (just like missing), bad radiator cap (not all of them are made to have coolant flow both directions), bad fan clutch (not locking up when hot).

"Missing" condition when warm. I noticed this on my old truck when the oil was very low. Presuming your oil is up to the correct level, it is possible that the oil pump is worn enough to lose effective pumping capacity when the engine and oil are hot. Oil will not fill the lifters enough, causing missing sounds because the valves are not opening. Since the pumps are meant to produce volume and not pressure, if they lose their ability to pump lots, they cannot make it up with pressure.

I will not suggest that you jack up the radiator cap far enough to drive a new truck under it, but hope you find the problem soon. This kind of issue, while not necessarily dangerous to the engine or driving, is extremely annoying and (good news here) usually inexpensive to repair, once it is diagnosed.

Good luck!

 

[Agnem]

Heath, I've read this thread now from front to back, and have to agree completely with Calvin. I reached the same conclusion about the same time he did. Thinking back to my experiences with Joe Lewis' truck, the miss was indeed caused by a valve. I.E. - Loss of compression in a particular cylinder. In your case, as the head expands from heat, a crack or gap some where is opening up releaving compression in one or more cylinder. At the same time, compression gasses are being expelled into the coolant. This same gap or crack has a one way valve like quality, so that as the motor cools, the vacuum that is created is sucking air in through the cylinder and air intake, rather than drawing the coolant back in from the overflow bottle. I will be pulling the 6.9 out of the Moosestang in the next week or two. Your welcome to "borrow" it for as long as you need until you either repair yours or resolve the issue some other way. The motor runs fine, but has a love affair with motor oil. Needs a quart every 500 miles.

 

[hesutton]

Well, the decision has been made for me. I have the truck in the shop now as the presumably leaking headgasket let go yesterday. I was hauling the camper back home and it just suddenly got hot very quickly. So I pull into a parking lot and let it cool down. Filled it back up with coolant and limped back a few miles to home.

What really sucks......... the biggest camping trip we had planned for the year is in two weeks. But, it's not going to happen. Now, if I find the right price on a newer truck, it might work, but I doubt I'll go that route.

What's worse is, I was moving Dad's fork lift to put the truck in the shop and it lost a rear spring mount and it's stuck in the way. Can't start on the truck until we can fix the fork lift.

Anyway, no more camping for me this year. I'll post up what the post mortum reveals when the time comes.

Heath

 

[Trying my best]

Sorry to hear that.

 

[junk]

Could always let a shop do the head gaskets if you have a shop you trust? Might just save the camping season. I always have trouble letting a shop do stuff to my cars, but sometimes there just isn't time for everything. Shop labor would probably be less $$ than a couple truck payments.

Good luck on the tear down!

 

[hesutton]

Sorry to hear that.

Could always let a shop do the head gaskets if you have a shop you trust? Might just save the camping season. I always have trouble letting a shop do stuff to my cars, but sometimes there just isn't time for everything. Shop labor would probably be less $$ than a couple truck payments.

Good luck on the tear down!

Thanks guys. There isn't a place I trust to do this work. Not at all. Mybe I'm crazy, but if anyone is turning a wrench on my truck is going to be me.

I'm heading to the shop after work today to help get that dang Cat Forklift fix so I can start on the truck.

Heath

 

[towcat]

Thanks guys. There isn't a place I trust to do this work. Not at all. Mybe I'm crazy, but if anyone is turning a wrench on my truck is going to be me.


Heath

heath-
another arguement for the old iron.....
if you can't trust someone else working on your stuff, you are in for a very steep learning curve on the new motors as well as learning a new vocabulary.
that joke about the OB/GYN turning into a mechanic will become a brutal reality.

 

[biggin92]

heath-
another arguement for the old iron.....
if you can't trust someone else working on your stuff, you are in for a very steep learning curve on the new motors as well as learning a new vocabulary.
that joke about the OB/GYN turning into a mechanic will become a brutal reality.

HAHAHAHA thats awesome!

 

[towcat]

HAHAHAHA thats awesome!

i gotta find that joke. it's really funny.
and it fits Heath to a "T";p