trust me on this. out here on the western side of the US, we have hills. lots of them not only steep ones, but ones that will go for miles too.
how well does an IDI tow?
- Thread starter superduty12v
- Start date
snaponprofile
Full Access Member
Yeah, I was at high elevations too where the air is much thinner. N/a makes it painful, turbo makes it fun.
One hill I didn't get up, petal buried tranny just slipped and wouldn't go, I rolled back down the hill, went up in second, tranny slipped and it rolled back down, then I put it in first and it made it up. Tranny dump all the fluid though. Luckily this was in some backroads up state NY but not fun at all. I'll get a pic of my load, never went on a scale with it.
My tranny blew a few months later. But one trannsmission later I have a guage, small cooler and soon a racerx TC and B&M shift kit.
Tractor is 6K and the trailer is 2.5K
One hill I didn't get up, petal buried tranny just slipped and wouldn't go, I rolled back down the hill, went up in second, tranny slipped and it rolled back down, then I put it in first and it made it up. Tranny dump all the fluid though. Luckily this was in some backroads up state NY but not fun at all. I'll get a pic of my load, never went on a scale with it.
My tranny blew a few months later. But one trannsmission later I have a guage, small cooler and soon a racerx TC and B&M shift kit.
Tractor is 6K and the trailer is 2.5K
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NMB2
Dunce
those are real mild loads.
I never got to drive my truck before I built the engine so I don't really have a before and after comparison for any of my mods, other than when I changed the compressor side of my turbo.
Before getting my IDI I drove/towed with a 2001 2500hd with a chipped 6.0 vortec and allison trans. That truck would blow the doors off of a 7.3 PSD. My biggest concern was that after building my IDI that I would be downgrading in the power and towing speed department. I am not ok with only being able to do 55mph, I'm one of those guys that likes to drive my truck with a trailer behind it, the same speed as I do without a trailer.
My 6.9 is a bit slower unloaded doing WOT accel compared to my 6.0, but that is all in part that I'm running 4.10's and a ZF5. With an automatic and or 3.55's there is no doubt in my mind, my 6.9 would be every bit as fast as my 6.0 vortec was.
That being said, as I already mentioned, my truck is better in every aspect in comparison to a stock to mild OBS 7.3 PSD. Unloaded, loaded, fuel mileage, acceleration, ect. I base this off of my experience using a 96 PSD and my buddy who has a 95 PSD. He tows the same trailer as I do, with a jeep weighing in a tad more than my truggy, and my 6.9 smokes him when we go up to oklahoma or arkansas.
As for comparing it to other IDI's.... as JD already mentioned, he rode in my truck a few months back.... no comparison. There is a guy in my unit with a 94 factory turboed IDI. 3.55's and ZF5.... once again, no comparison.
I average 65-70mph all the time towing, I cant handle going slower than that, and I'm not talking just flats.... I dont like dipping below 60-55mph on big grades. I usually just get into the left lane and start passing the trucks that slow down. So it is possible to get the power out of these motors, and IMO the cost Isn't bad.
I never got to drive my truck before I built the engine so I don't really have a before and after comparison for any of my mods, other than when I changed the compressor side of my turbo.
Before getting my IDI I drove/towed with a 2001 2500hd with a chipped 6.0 vortec and allison trans. That truck would blow the doors off of a 7.3 PSD. My biggest concern was that after building my IDI that I would be downgrading in the power and towing speed department. I am not ok with only being able to do 55mph, I'm one of those guys that likes to drive my truck with a trailer behind it, the same speed as I do without a trailer.
My 6.9 is a bit slower unloaded doing WOT accel compared to my 6.0, but that is all in part that I'm running 4.10's and a ZF5. With an automatic and or 3.55's there is no doubt in my mind, my 6.9 would be every bit as fast as my 6.0 vortec was.
That being said, as I already mentioned, my truck is better in every aspect in comparison to a stock to mild OBS 7.3 PSD. Unloaded, loaded, fuel mileage, acceleration, ect. I base this off of my experience using a 96 PSD and my buddy who has a 95 PSD. He tows the same trailer as I do, with a jeep weighing in a tad more than my truggy, and my 6.9 smokes him when we go up to oklahoma or arkansas.
As for comparing it to other IDI's.... as JD already mentioned, he rode in my truck a few months back.... no comparison. There is a guy in my unit with a 94 factory turboed IDI. 3.55's and ZF5.... once again, no comparison.
I average 65-70mph all the time towing, I cant handle going slower than that, and I'm not talking just flats.... I dont like dipping below 60-55mph on big grades. I usually just get into the left lane and start passing the trucks that slow down. So it is possible to get the power out of these motors, and IMO the cost Isn't bad.
snaponprofile
Full Access Member
The trailer combo is 8.5K, plus the truck, plus I've towed that often with 2K in the bed=18.5K total. According to web wood, the logs were 7,093+2.5K trailer+ truck=17.5K.
Thats not light to me, I guess I'm just thinking wrong though.
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NMB2
Dunce
I don't take into consideration the weight of the truck, I think its pointless when you're talking about what we're hauling.
Also, I find it hard to believe that trailer is 2,500lbs considering my hauler is much larger than it, and weighs that, but I cant see the floor? Must have something heavy for a floor.
Regardless, No, I dont think 17.5k is all that heavy. I have pulled 18k trailers behind my chevy, which brings my weight to about 25k, and I have pulled a 12k trailer behind my IDI, effortlessly, which brings my weight to about 20k.
Also, I find it hard to believe that trailer is 2,500lbs considering my hauler is much larger than it, and weighs that, but I cant see the floor? Must have something heavy for a floor.
Regardless, No, I dont think 17.5k is all that heavy. I have pulled 18k trailers behind my chevy, which brings my weight to about 25k, and I have pulled a 12k trailer behind my IDI, effortlessly, which brings my weight to about 20k.
NMB2
Dunce
dont get me wrong, I'm not trying to diss you or say that 18k total weight is light... but its not a "big load" by any means.
snaponprofile
Full Access Member
For a turbo motor it isn't a big load. I'm talking from the point of view of n/a. I got my turbo after these loads.
The flat is my buddy's and over build, rated for 12K.
The flat is my buddy's and over build, rated for 12K.
snaponprofile
Full Access Member
Yeah, no I get what your saying. They just seemed big to me when n/a.
NMB2
Dunce
from what I've seen of an N/A and even alot of peoples turboed IDI's... that load would bring them down to 45mph up grades. I'm just not ok driving something like that.
And like I've already said, I cant really say which of my mods did what. I did them all at the exact same time.
I just have other trucks to compare mine to, and hopefully I can get a dyno sheet for the fun of it soon.
I also dont have to deal with any of the trans problems having the ZF5, but its like driving a dump truck with it lol.
I dont think N/A or even the stock turbo motors are really good for towing much anything if you want to be able to run normal speeds. However with a DPS or Moose fuel system, turbo upgrades, studs, boost up into the 20psi range... that will bring an IDI to life like you couldnt imagine unless you have done it, or seen one that has. People always talk about cost to modify them.... I dont think I have all that much into my truck. Probably about $6,000 and most of that was into my engine/trans, and I can think of about $1000 worth of stuff I didnt need, I just wanted. Thats pretty reasonable considering a stock OBS PSD goes for that, and more.....
And like I've already said, I cant really say which of my mods did what. I did them all at the exact same time.
I just have other trucks to compare mine to, and hopefully I can get a dyno sheet for the fun of it soon.
I also dont have to deal with any of the trans problems having the ZF5, but its like driving a dump truck with it lol.
I dont think N/A or even the stock turbo motors are really good for towing much anything if you want to be able to run normal speeds. However with a DPS or Moose fuel system, turbo upgrades, studs, boost up into the 20psi range... that will bring an IDI to life like you couldnt imagine unless you have done it, or seen one that has. People always talk about cost to modify them.... I dont think I have all that much into my truck. Probably about $6,000 and most of that was into my engine/trans, and I can think of about $1000 worth of stuff I didnt need, I just wanted. Thats pretty reasonable considering a stock OBS PSD goes for that, and more.....
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snaponprofile
Full Access Member
Yes, I am only banks turbo'd with the IP up 2 flats around 13-14psi.
i'm trying to figure out which of your mods brought you this performance. i'm trying to build an engine i have sitting here to similar specs to yours but i question the price n time/performance of the 2.5" uppipe and 3" exhaust housing. I would think more volume to build pressure preturbo would just create lag but i'm sure theres positives to it if you went through the effort to do it.. would like to see what kind of numbers youre putting down
NMB2
Dunce
I probably have the fastest spooling truck on here. Or at least I did back when I posted my videos'. It slaps from 0-12psi instantly, at will, in any gear, and makes it to 20 within about 2-3 more seconds.
the 093 turbo has a small hot side, which allows it to spool this fast. The stock up pipe may of worked fine, but I cut it up when I pulled the turbo, so I built a new one. The 3" exhaust housing is a 100% must, the stock housing is a bottleneck.
Myself and Dyoung were both able to make it to 20 and beyond with the stock T03 comp side, but for $500 I swapped out to a MUCH larger comp side, that made the turbo much more efficient, lowered EGT's, and allowed me to run higher boost easier.
the 093 turbo has a small hot side, which allows it to spool this fast. The stock up pipe may of worked fine, but I cut it up when I pulled the turbo, so I built a new one. The 3" exhaust housing is a 100% must, the stock housing is a bottleneck.
Myself and Dyoung were both able to make it to 20 and beyond with the stock T03 comp side, but for $500 I swapped out to a MUCH larger comp side, that made the turbo much more efficient, lowered EGT's, and allowed me to run higher boost easier.
hmm i wonder how an 093 would work with a larger compressor wheel like typ4s and a larger exhaust housing like yours.. anyways, im driving this thread way off track. thanks for the info man.
where did you get your larger exhaust housing?
where did you get your larger exhaust housing?
NMB2
Dunce
my comp wheel and housing is WAY bigger than typ4's. And I built my exhaust housing.
For towing , going balls out on fuel mods isnt going to be the catch all for getting you over the hill, it just builds more heat after a point when you have a big load on.
Best mod I have for towing is that three speed Brownie
That baby gets me over all kinds of stuff that I'm quite positive would be a challange without it. and I don't have my pump set particularly hot. I have it set to where it doesn't smoke under load and I don't have to watch my EGTs like a hawk pulling hard grades, in fact, I have it set just right to where I can pretty well ignore them
Having the right gear to keep the engine in it's power range for pulling does the most good. The factory box has way too much spread in between gears. You have a limited range where it pulls and then it drops off and you have to drop a gear. Any kind of splitter that can get you those in between gears will make all teh difference in the world for getting over a mountain. It can mean teh difference between going 25 miles 3-4mph slower or 10 mph slower and the ability to be able to pickup the next half gear sooner when it levels out a little where you couldn't if you had to grab a whole gear.
All this talk about needing tons of power to pull is simply foolishness.50 years ago a semi truck driver would have killed for the kind of power these things have, and I remember when I first drove big trucks, I was stuck in a few old relics that actually had LESS power than these things ( where the heck do you think I got to liking those Brownie boxes so much, I cut my teeth on a rig with 20 forward gears
You guys fail to realize that up until the 80s aside from a few odd Cat engines ( which were dozer engines that were pressed into service in trucks for heavy haul, even at that I had teh biggest thing available in 72 and that was a 425 TA cat 1693 and that was a D9 engine that was 390 and they added 35 hp for teh aftercooler, we dont count those they didnt really start making truck engines until the 80s aside from some local haul engines), most big truck engines were around 190, 220, 250, 260, and a REAL big hoss ooh , aahh 290 hp. and these little toys that guys nowdays would laugh at a salesman if he tried to sell them something that small to go in a pickup, were moving 45 ft trailers pulling whatever the old max weight limit was ( heck I've slept since then I think it was 72380 , most of those things didn't have brakes on the steer axle, it made it real interesting when they upped it to 80k for those of us without them of course, that number had generally been a suggestion anyway
When teh average big truck went up to 350 hp those guys thought they were REALLY doing it, then 400 became the norm. The torque figures got real solid in teh mid 80s
If you were to take one of our engines and drop it into a big truck from the 60s with it's stock tranny and run against it you would leave the sucker in the dust. The kind of power figures they are pressing out of these new pickups is simply insane For crying out loud, what are you going to do with them, take them to Australia and hook them up to a road train?
The point I'm making here is folks have become a bunch of spoiled babies expecting a piece of equipment to do EVERYTHING. be sports car, babe magnet, and work horse. I hear folks complaining all the time about the price tag on new trucks being more than a new house, well, whose fault is that? If so many people didnt want a truck to be all things to all people and would just be happy with a truck that does what a truck is SUPPOSED to do , which is pull heavy stuff around reliably at low service costs, which is what you buy a truck for, then new trucks wouldn't cost what they do.THey would still be nice utilitarian rigs with metal dashes and rubber floor mats that an average guy could walk into a dealership and still buy.
If you want a sports car, BUY ONE. If you want a fluff wagon babe magnet BUY ONE. If you want one of the last true remaining real pickup trucks out there that still does the job it was designed for and won't put you in the poor house in the process, then you are in the right place
Best mod I have for towing is that three speed Brownie
That baby gets me over all kinds of stuff that I'm quite positive would be a challange without it. and I don't have my pump set particularly hot. I have it set to where it doesn't smoke under load and I don't have to watch my EGTs like a hawk pulling hard grades, in fact, I have it set just right to where I can pretty well ignore themHaving the right gear to keep the engine in it's power range for pulling does the most good. The factory box has way too much spread in between gears. You have a limited range where it pulls and then it drops off and you have to drop a gear. Any kind of splitter that can get you those in between gears will make all teh difference in the world for getting over a mountain. It can mean teh difference between going 25 miles 3-4mph slower or 10 mph slower and the ability to be able to pickup the next half gear sooner when it levels out a little where you couldn't if you had to grab a whole gear.
All this talk about needing tons of power to pull is simply foolishness.50 years ago a semi truck driver would have killed for the kind of power these things have, and I remember when I first drove big trucks, I was stuck in a few old relics that actually had LESS power than these things ( where the heck do you think I got to liking those Brownie boxes so much, I cut my teeth on a rig with 20 forward gears
You guys fail to realize that up until the 80s aside from a few odd Cat engines ( which were dozer engines that were pressed into service in trucks for heavy haul, even at that I had teh biggest thing available in 72 and that was a 425 TA cat 1693 and that was a D9 engine that was 390 and they added 35 hp for teh aftercooler, we dont count those they didnt really start making truck engines until the 80s aside from some local haul engines), most big truck engines were around 190, 220, 250, 260, and a REAL big hoss ooh , aahh 290 hp. and these little toys that guys nowdays would laugh at a salesman if he tried to sell them something that small to go in a pickup, were moving 45 ft trailers pulling whatever the old max weight limit was ( heck I've slept since then I think it was 72380 , most of those things didn't have brakes on the steer axle, it made it real interesting when they upped it to 80k for those of us without them of course, that number had generally been a suggestion anyway
When teh average big truck went up to 350 hp those guys thought they were REALLY doing it, then 400 became the norm. The torque figures got real solid in teh mid 80s
If you were to take one of our engines and drop it into a big truck from the 60s with it's stock tranny and run against it you would leave the sucker in the dust. The kind of power figures they are pressing out of these new pickups is simply insane For crying out loud, what are you going to do with them, take them to Australia and hook them up to a road train?
The point I'm making here is folks have become a bunch of spoiled babies expecting a piece of equipment to do EVERYTHING. be sports car, babe magnet, and work horse. I hear folks complaining all the time about the price tag on new trucks being more than a new house, well, whose fault is that? If so many people didnt want a truck to be all things to all people and would just be happy with a truck that does what a truck is SUPPOSED to do , which is pull heavy stuff around reliably at low service costs, which is what you buy a truck for, then new trucks wouldn't cost what they do.THey would still be nice utilitarian rigs with metal dashes and rubber floor mats that an average guy could walk into a dealership and still buy.
If you want a sports car, BUY ONE. If you want a fluff wagon babe magnet BUY ONE. If you want one of the last true remaining real pickup trucks out there that still does the job it was designed for and won't put you in the poor house in the process, then you are in the right place
