E4OD Buying Guide?

[Pele]

So I'm looking for a used 1992-1994 F250 4x4 Diesel as a towing rig for my track car. I figure I'll need a 18 ft trailer...

My current truck's got a ZF5 in it. I like it, but I think with an oversized truck and trailer, the added work of running manual would be too much... I have to brace myself against the seatback and use my whole weight to force the clutch pedal down. This makes it hard to turn the whole way around when backing up. Given my bad experiences in backing trailers up, I kinda wanna be able to see where I'm going.

I originally bought my truck with the manual because I like the simplicity ane bulletproof reliability of a manual.
I've driven vehicles with blown hydraulics for months at a time, just rev match on shifts and the shifter goes into gear like butter without the clutch.
I've driven for years with no synchros, again, rev matching and/or double clutching and it's good.
Skipping trashed gears and being able to roll start are also nice.

I really hate driving automatics... Automatic transmissions are kinda voodoo black magic to me. That's not to say I don't know how they work, but they're pretty complex to work on.

Anyhow, given this and the E4OD's reputation for being failure prone I was wondering if anyone can give some pointers on how to check one out when checking out a used truck?

 

[sootman73]

see how it shifts. the stock E4OD programming is very lacking. you'll think that the shifts are way to slow and then get used to lockup in third and OD. you'll think its shifting again. its pretty bad and annoying.

Check the color of the fluid should be bright red but slightly darker is okay just means it prob needs a new filter and fluid change. check to see if the trans has been rebuilt and if it has the electronics updates. the neutral safety switch has an updated unit. reverse takes a while to kick in so dont think there's a sticky valve or anything.

the shifts prob wont be very firm if you can feel them at all. make sure it doesn't slip in any gear. it'll be hard to tell if the TC isn't locked up. you'll be able to tell in third and fourth though.

 

[towcat]

So I'm looking for a used 1992-1994 F250 4x4 Diesel as a towing rig for my track car. I figure I'll need a 18 ft trailer...

My current truck's got a ZF5 in it. I like it, but I think with an oversized truck and trailer, the added work of running manual would be too much... I have to brace myself against the seatback and use my whole weight to force the clutch pedal down. This makes it hard to turn the whole way around when backing up. Given my bad experiences in backing trailers up, I kinda wanna be able to see where I'm going.

I originally bought my truck with the manual because I like the simplicity ane bulletproof reliability of a manual.
I've driven vehicles with blown hydraulics for months at a time, just rev match on shifts and the shifter goes into gear like butter without the clutch.
I've driven for years with no synchros, again, rev matching and/or double clutching and it's good.
Skipping trashed gears and being able to roll start are also nice.

I really hate driving automatics... Automatic transmissions are kinda voodoo black magic to me. That's not to say I don't know how they work, but they're pretty complex to work on.

Anyhow, given this and the E4OD's reputation for being failure prone I was wondering if anyone can give some pointers on how to check one out when checking out a used truck?

it is by far cheaper to fix your clutch pedal problem than it is to replace with a unreliable automatic.
Post what you have in your signature line first. I will then walk you through what you need to do to make your ZF more livable.

 

[david85]

I prefer the E4OD over the ZF, but as towcat said, you can improve your clutch without having to actually go to an automatic. Swapping to an SMF kit will be a little pricy, but not as bad as buying, then building up an E4OD (or completely different truck). I used a Valair clutch kit on a powerstroke once and its much easier to hold the pedal with that kit compared to the original but at the same time, the valair is rated for more torque. Grear clatter is the only real drawback but that happens only under 1400 RPM.

 

[Michael Fowler]

Where are the electrical connections? I occasionally get a flashing OD light when it rains, so I think I need to pack the connection with dielectric grease. Which connection?

 

[trackspeeder]

Where are the electrical connections? I occasionally get a flashing OD light when it rains, so I think I need to pack the connection with dielectric grease. Which connection?

Check the computer. Its located in a nice spot on the firewall. (Next to the E brake) When the windshield develops a water leak it will drip on the brain and make it do funky things.

Other connections. Solenoid pack, passenger side of the tranny. Do not pry this connection. You will have bigger problems. Squeeze and yank by the wires.
The Transmission Range Sensor, on the left side. Depending on the year. The VSS is in the tranny or rear diff. Pre 92 on the tranny or T case. Post 92 on the diff.

 

[Goofyexponent]

FIPL can cause limp mode too.....that's what I am going through now. I have it down to a bad engine harness, good thing I have a spare motor with a damn near mint harness stored with BigRigTech's spare parts!

 

[Pele]

it is by far cheaper to fix your clutch pedal problem than it is to replace with a unreliable automatic.
Post what you have in your signature line first. I will then walk you through what you need to do to make your ZF more livable.

I prefer the E4OD over the ZF, but as towcat said, you can improve your clutch without having to actually go to an automatic. Swapping to an SMF kit will be a little pricy, but not as bad as buying, then building up an E4OD (or completely different truck). I used a Valair clutch kit on a powerstroke once and its much easier to hold the pedal with that kit compared to the original but at the same time, the valair is rated for more torque. Grear clatter is the only real drawback but that happens only under 1400 RPM.

Because I want to change trucks as well... My current truck is a 30 ft long monstrosity that the county zoning board is classifying as a commercial vehicle... I gotta sell it and that's part of why I'm buying a new truck.

 

[Pele]

One other question:

Is it possible for an E4OD to just up and die one day? Just be driving along normally and all of a sudden, not move in any selection? Or will it give some warning before it dies catastrophically.


Last car I had with an automatic, a 1985 Toyota Camry did that to me:
I was cruising along one day and all of a sudden, it was like I was in Neutral. Pulled it over on the highway... Fluid was still pink and full. Didn't move in any gear. It might crawl if I put it in gear and floored it on flat ground, but other than that... It was dead in the water.

I pulled the plates and left it on the side of the highway. Impound called me few days later and I told them to keep it.

 

[david85]

Unfortunately, yes. Snapped input shaft, blown torque converter or stripped overdrive hub splines (assuming aluminum carrier) are all posssible and there is usually no prior warning.

Slipping clutches will give you warning ahead of time though and that is more likely to happen usually.

 

[Pele]

Unfortunately, yes. Snapped input shaft, blown torque converter or stripped overdrive hub splines (assuming aluminum carrier) are all posssible and there is usually no prior warning.

Slipping clutches will give you warning ahead of time though and that is more likely to happen usually.

If I don't neutral bomb or get really ******* it from dead stops, and lock it out of overdrive when I'm towing, I can avoid those catastrophic failures, right?

How can I tell if my transmission has an aluminum carrier? Can that carrier be upgraded separately or is that something I'd do if I'm going to do a buildup?

 

[trackspeeder]

If I don't neutral bomb or get really ******* it from dead stops, and lock it out of overdrive when I'm towing, I can avoid those catastrophic failures, right?

How can I tell if my transmission has an aluminum carrier? Can that carrier be upgraded separately or is that something I'd do if I'm going to do a buildup?

Baby the thing it will be fine. Most of the time the E4OD will give you a warning when its going to puke.

Now for the internal crap. The only way to tell if the carriers are aluminum is during the tear down. Unless you blow one out. Then you will see some interesting aluminum stuff in the pan.

If your rebuilding it toss the carriers replace them with steel.

 

[david85]

Neutral dropping is whats most likely to snap the shaft or strip the overdrive hub so those can be avoided assuming the previous owner didn't do that either.

Steel carrier gears are found in superduty (f450 rated) trucks in 98 and up or in heavy duty rebuilds. The transmission history is the only way to know what is in there short of tearing it down. Stock rebuilds will not have steel gears.

The torque converters unfortunately can go seemingly for no reason and gentile driving habits don't seem to make much of a difference. Stock converters are kinda like time bombs when they go. In most cases there is very little prior warning. Just like your camry, you simply end up in a no drive situation from one moment to the next. Seems to happen right when pulling off the line in many cases and you don't have to be pulling hard either.

I've heard and read accounts of it happening to other people, but no first hand experience fortunately. Again, if the transmission was rebuilt, the spec sheet should have that info in it.

The fear of overdrive is exaggerated though. The overdrive hub is at the inside end of the input shaft and is always transmiting power regardless of what gear you are in. Locking out overdrive does not keep power from flowing through the overdrive section. The only reason to not use overdrive is if the transmission is constantly hunting between 3rd and 4th, or if the RPMs are too low causing lack of power. There is also a slightly increased risk of transmission overheating because the pump on the transmission spins at crank shaft speed. Lower engine RPM, means lower lube and cooler flow. But in reality a failed E4OD in a senario like that probably had underlying issues before hand and heavy loading in low RPMs in overdrive is in practice nearly impossible because most engines need a minimum of 2000 RPM to effectively move a heavy trailer.

Overall, the idea that towing in overdrive kills transmissions is a myth at least when it comes to the E4OD. The internals are more than strong enough to survive towing in overdrive and that top gear is there to be used (the overdrive gear is actually more massive than the main forward gear)

Ideally you would look for something that is bone stock or if there is a turbo under the hood chances are the transmission has been rebuilt at some point. Ask to see the build sheet or at least who rebuilt it.

 

[Pele]

Thanks guys...

I'm just really scared of automatic transmissions. In my mind, they are powered by voodoo black magic and you need a PhD in Quantum Physics to repair one.

I believe if I get an E4OD equipped truck, I will save up for a heavy duty rebuild using 4R100 / 98+ Super Duty parts shortly thereafter.

 

[sootman73]

Well all auto trans have the possibility of dieing all of a sudden. actually everything has the possibility of dieing all of a sudden and leaving you somewhere.

is this trans more prone to it? No. treat it like it was designed for and it will hold up. Take care of it and it wont let you down. Keep up on fluid changes and keep it cool. Get a truck with 4.10 gears since its going to be a tow vehicle. it will allow you to pull in overdrive without worries. 3.55's requires more cooling and more attention while towing a trailer.

The right gearing makes the difference between liking to pull the trailer and never wanting to.