Diesel + Hydrogen = WHOooaaa!

[bobracing]

It worked fine, I gained approx 4mpg, but it leaked like a sieve.. It was dismantled, all of the plates were sand blasted, new different gasket material was aquired and about 200 gaskets have been hand cut, the number of plates was fine-tuned based on new info, the system dedicated 150A alternator was removed and is being re-installed in the factory location as the ONLY alternator, ozone generators are being added (O3 -hyper oxidizer) and the overall look of the now single unit has changed completely... I just went at lunch today and picked up a new 3/8-18NPT tap to continue working on it. There has been a tremendous amount of other projects going on lately, which why only now am I able to get back to the bio-beast rebuild..

Did you get the new generator together? How does it work? Still getting +4mpg?

 

[Hydro-idi]

Holy Toledo did I miss out on this forum. Sure is quite the analysis in regards to these hydrogen setups.
I recently installed a hydrogen setup with all the bells and whistles....yet remains a very simple and efficient design. I use one large dry cell generator that is mounted behind the front bumper. My holding tank (coolant reservoir) holds a mix of potassium hydroxide and distilled water (I try and maintain 25 amps at all times). There are 2 inlets and outlets going to my generator. Toggle switch, gauge, and all the appropriate wiring are installed which is very important when running these babies. Hydrogen gas goes back into reservoir then gets directed through a stainless steel filter apparatus before entering into my air intake which helps remove bubbles and liquid. Dry cell generator was tested before installation to see what it would put out. On test stand....running 25 amps, it put out an average of 4LPM which is very impressive for a single unit.
Results=
-Improved power and less smoke.
-Average MPG without Hydrogen=12.67 running used atf. 16.3 running diesel fuel.
-Average MPG with Hydrogen=19.57 running used atf. Mileage unknown with diesel fuel......I'm too cheap to find out .

I am very pleased with my hydrogen setup. Yes, there is lots and lots of controversy because it takes energy to make this additional hydrogen energy. Many think it is not efficient, and many think it is. Well yes, it does in fact put more load on the alternator, which may lead to the engine and alternator having to work a bit harder. But if that was really detrimental to efficiency, would I be getting an additional 7mpg? This is just my opinion. In all cases, it takes energy to make energy. For example=heat from internal combustion engines is wasted energy....and lots of it. People think that hybrid cars are so efficient because they get 50mpg. They don't realize that the resources to create these battery cells takes MASSIVE amounts of energy to produce them. Lots of fuel, non-renewable resources, etc. are derived from the earth to create this car that gets 50mpg. So is it truly an efficient design? The answer is no. In fact, studies say that it is more efficient to run a Hummer SUV than it is a Prius. You need to think about this for a second before thinking I am full of crap lol. Sorry if I am going on a bit of a tangent here but I figured I would chime in about these hydrogen setups and the controversy that they might cause. Bottom line is....energy will almost always be needed to create additional energy.

 

[Silver Burner]

I personally never understood all the naysayers about the hydrogen setup... They're saying all the extra energy you spend making the hydrogen for your engine can't possibly yield any gains, but that would be like saying a belt-driven supercharger won't make any gains because you're putting all this increased load on the engine to spin the supercharger. Same could be said for a turbo as well. I'm a believer. I just don't know how to make the setup or how much it would cost to do yet.

 

[89greendiesel]

i think the engine is just being subjected to a slightly higher load across the number of hours it is running and the 60% of energy that is wasted with diesels is being utilized and maybe only 56% is wasted now.

The waste heat numbers are just food for thought.

 

[93IDIT]

I personally never understood all the naysayers about the hydrogen setup... They're saying all the extra energy you spend making the hydrogen for your engine can't possibly yield any gains, but that would be like saying a belt-driven supercharger won't make any gains because you're putting all this increased load on the engine to spin the supercharger. Same could be said for a turbo as well. I'm a believer. I just don't know how to make the setup or how much it would cost to do yet.

Most of the naysayer's comments come from the fact that the current theory on physics is that it takes more energy to split the water into hydrogen and oxygen than you get out of burning it and recombining it back into h2o. With our current popular consensus, I can see how this could be a problem. The fact that we don't completely understand the universe we live in leaves me open to the possibility that this might work. I have not attempted a hydrogen setup yet but am open to experimenting in the future.

 

[Matrix37495]

There was a post on the last page about making the HHO with chemicals. Could you do that, then pump it into a tank and regulate it down? Sort of like a variation of propane injection..

 

[BioFarmer93]

Hey Bob,
Yes it's all together and mounted on its installation board along with the mist stopper and desiccant dryer, I just haven't mounted it up yet in Henry or swapped in the 150A alternator. It's just sitting, taking up room in the garage- I haven't felt the same urgency to re-install it since I started running home brew because that in itself lowered my fuel bill by 70%. I'm still going to re-install it though for the added mileage and to help clean up the extra smoke (early in the heat cycle) from the home brew.

 

[BioFarmer93]

There was a post on the last page about making the HHO with chemicals. Could you do that, then pump it into a tank and regulate it down? Sort of like a variation of propane injection..

Matrix-
I won't swear to it but I'm pretty sure that was about making just H2, not HHO (Brown's gas). Making H2 chemically is about as easy as falling off of a log, just dump a handful of iron filings into a glass bottle with some dilute H2SO4 (battery acid) in it and quick stretch a balloon over the mouth. Old Coke bottles work perfectly for this and in a minute or two you'll have a hydrogen balloon that wants to fly away. H2 by itself is safe to compress and is done so every day for commercial use in tanks of every size, but the stochiometric mix of H2 & O that comprises Browns gas is very unstable, as it is a fuel and oxidizer in one. That is why it is never compressed (self ignition pressure is a little over 200psi IIRC) and some of the people that have tried it have ended up dead or injured. Even with the flow restriction of my gas dryers, I seriously doubt that you would see 2psi anywhere in the system.

 

[BioFarmer93]

Holy Toledo did I miss out on this forum. Sure is quite the analysis in regards to these hydrogen setups.
I recently installed a hydrogen setup with all the bells and whistles....yet remains a very simple and efficient design. I use one large dry cell generator that is mounted behind the front bumper. My holding tank (coolant reservoir) holds a mix of potassium hydroxide and distilled water (I try and maintain 25 amps at all times). There are 2 inlets and outlets going to my generator. Toggle switch, gauge, and all the appropriate wiring are installed which is very important when running these babies. Hydrogen gas goes back into reservoir then gets directed through a stainless steel filter apparatus before entering into my air intake which helps remove bubbles and liquid. Dry cell generator was tested before installation to see what it would put out. On test stand....running 25 amps, it put out an average of 4LPM which is very impressive for a single unit.
Results=
-Improved power and less smoke.
-Average MPG without Hydrogen=12.67 running used atf. 16.3 running diesel fuel.
-Average MPG with Hydrogen=19.57 running used atf. Mileage unknown with diesel fuel......I'm too cheap to find out .

I am very pleased with my hydrogen setup. Yes, there is lots and lots of controversy because it takes energy to make this additional hydrogen energy. Many think it is not efficient, and many think it is. Well yes, it does in fact put more load on the alternator, which may lead to the engine and alternator having to work a bit harder. But if that was really detrimental to efficiency, would I be getting an additional 7mpg? This is just my opinion. In all cases, it takes energy to make energy. For example=heat from internal combustion engines is wasted energy....and lots of it. People think that hybrid cars are so efficient because they get 50mpg. They don't realize that the resources to create these battery cells takes MASSIVE amounts of energy to produce them. Lots of fuel, non-renewable resources, etc. are derived from the earth to create this car that gets 50mpg. So is it truly an efficient design? The answer is no. In fact, studies say that it is more efficient to run a Hummer SUV than it is a Prius. You need to think about this for a second before thinking I am full of crap lol. Sorry if I am going on a bit of a tangent here but I figured I would chime in about these hydrogen setups and the controversy that they might cause. Bottom line is....energy will almost always be needed to create additional energy.

Hydro-IDI,
4LPM@25A? You're pumpin' (high moisture content, not necessarily visible) steam my friend, no way in God's green earth is that all HHO. 1LPM of clean dry HHO @ 10A is kickin' MAJOR ass, and only a handful of very dedicated backyard scientists have been able to achieve it, and it dang sure was not accomplished with a store-bought system. Not trying to embarrass you, as I see claims like this all the time on the HHO forum, and after a little clean-up, and usually the addition of a plate or two to get the VpC where it needs to be for proper thermal performance & efficiency, not to mention the addition of a gas dryer of some kind, the LPM number is a lot more realistic. PM me if you want to talk more. I really don't feel up to re-igniting the incipient ****-storm of controversy on this subject here.

 

[BioFarmer93]

i think the engine is just being subjected to a slightly higher load across the number of hours it is running and the 60% of energy that is wasted with diesels is being utilized and maybe only 56% is wasted now.

The waste heat numbers are just food for thought.

-Faster flame propagation (flame front) makes for higher specific impulse and lower temps (less time spent burning cancels out higher temp fuel type). You are very much on the right track in your thinking about the waste heat.

 

[Matrix37495]

Thanks for clearing that up.

Does plain hydrogen give any benefit? Or is it minimal since there is no oxidizer?

 

[DesertBen44]

I want to see more videos and pics of that setup! Whether or not it works it looks badass Chillin in the bed!

I was recently reading about HHO and whatnot, trying to decide if it was worth pursuing in my truck

Basically I just wanted to say thanks for being one of the bold ones to put in the time and money to experiment with it! and keep the result data comin

 

[Hydro-idi]

To BioFarmer93
I had my hydrogen kit custom made by a guy in Lodi who was a good friend with the original inventor of the hydrogen injection system......back in the day waaay before my time. Now when I say the "original inventor", I am talking about the inventor of this specific design that he has created. Now I am not 100% sure if it is pure HHO, but it is pumping out 4LPM of something ! All that I know is it is VERY flammable. When I had it installed, I put injection tube in a quart sized bottle for a little while, put bottle upside down on my antenna and put a lighter up to it and ! The darn thing blew up into a million pieces and sounded like a cannon haha. So I would say it is working quite well.

 

[BioFarmer93]

Thanks for clearing that up.

Does plain hydrogen give any benefit? Or is it minimal since there is no oxidizer?

It gives a smaller benefit- primarily because it's using some of the O2 that would otherwise be available for the diesel fuel burn. The differences between bottled H2 and fresh HHO as combustion enhancers is one of the things that has been well documented, however those results were for a N-A engine. I personally feel that if 1 or 2% of bottled H2 were added to a turbo'd diesel with the fuel turned down maybe one flat, that there would be no loss of power, no smoke and probably improved mileage... At this point though, that is just conjecture on my part.

 

[BioFarmer93]

To BioFarmer93
I had my hydrogen kit custom made by a guy in Lodi who was a good friend with the original inventor of the hydrogen injection system......back in the day waaay before my time. Now when I say the "original inventor", I am talking about the inventor of this specific design that he has created. Now I am not 100% sure if it is pure HHO, but it is pumping out 4LPM of something ! All that I know is it is VERY flammable. When I had it installed, I put injection tube in a quart sized bottle for a little while, put bottle upside down on my antenna and put a lighter up to it and ! The darn thing blew up into a million pieces and sounded like a cannon haha. So I would say it is working quite well.

No doubt it's working, that's for sure! I hope the "quart sized bottle" was thin plastic, not glass?? Not trying to play school teacher here, but that's the main way that people become blind, deaf, crippled etc. with HHO. Hydrogen in air (lotsa nitrogen) has a flame speed just barely faster than gasoline fumes in air, HHO on the other hand has a flame speed of over 7200fps. That's cookin' bubba- and it make for an explosion that's many times more powerful than non-oxygen enhanced hydrogen... I'm just glad you're OK. What?? speak up I can't hear you! ! take care.