Deep Roots

[rckslash2010]

I just happened across one of your video's.
http://s68.photobucket.com/albums/i6/DeepRootsNursery/?action=view&current=MVI_0409.flv
That's awesome, I want!!!
How does it work with the zf5?
I'm starting with a n.a. I guess the first thing I should think about would be the proper head studs. Then what kind of turbo to get, I see yours is a ats 088. And then a super moose pump with injectors. I can see a lot of money going into the truck. I've already put a bunch into it, so why not more? Now I just need to find some money, anybody got some laying around that I can have? I would sell my soul to the devil, but I already did that a few years ago for a case of beer, and a pack of smokes.

Seriously though, it's something that I'm interested in. Even if it takes me a couple of years, my truck will be able to run like this, and better. I wouldn't mind hitting a couple of sled pulls either. I can see air lockers in my future also. And I will run with Ford power, if I wanted a Cummings, I'll go buy a Dodge.

 

[Diesel JD]

Drew)AKA DeepRoots is an awesome guy. He and his wife hosted me for an afternoon this past summer. He's an offshore mechanic and real handy obviously. That truck was originally C6 and no a ZF5. He let me drive that truck and it is really nice of course it was just in town and so it couldn't really shine at 45-50 mph. You really don't nead head studs if you're going to keep the boost reasonable. On a 7.3 reasonable is 13 psi maybe 15 altough without an intercooler anything much over 12-13 is wasted with most of these turbos. I too have the ATS 088 turbo and it sounds great and makes a lot of boost when you need it. Drew's boosts faster than mine with the Moose pump, but only a little. I suspect the difference would come at the high end. The Moose gives way more fuel than a stock even turbocharged motor can burn so I'd imagine it would keep right on boosting until the engine blew up. Even with my stock pump I can hit over 10 psi if I really push it, I don't like to go that far because until the turbo spools all the way up it is very smokey and tends to give diesels a bad name and once I'm at 10 I hate to see it for very long since I am running reused 6.9 bolts(aka playing with fire). If you ahve an 88 and want to improve it I would start gathering parts and just be patient unless you have a lot of cash to spend on it. For the Moose Pump, I think there's a sticky in the marketplace or you could just PM agnem, he found a Stanadyne shop willing to take the project on and invested some of his oewn money into the R&D. The bottom line is that you have to send him a core and the better core it is, the less the build will cost. Ideally it's a factory turbo 7.3 IDI pump in very good condition for the lowest possible bill. Most users have been very happy and Mel stands behind the Moose Pump in the rare instances that problems have occured with the pump. As far as the turbo goes if you want a new kit Hypermax is probably the way to go. They can be had for under 2 grand brand new and Hypermax still cares about IDI people and continues to offer products for us. You could probably find a used turbo by poking around junkyards, Craigslist, or ebay. Your main decision is wastegated versus non wastegated. I like non gated lower EGTs and is best when you need it most, lots of load on the engine and or going up a grade, the times when the newer trucks would whip us in stock trim or not even get it done themselves. I think there might be an article on wastegate vs non gated turbos in the tech section...I don't recall but that has been beat to death ad nauseaum here. If you're dead set on studs buy ARP studs Icanfixall probably has the applicable part# but they are 1/2" thread studs for non specific engine applications with that thread size. You definitely need a boost and pyrometer gauge if you go down this road. Good luck and maybe Drew will stop in and post his thoughts if he has internet access wherever he is.

 

[rckslash2010]

Ya, I was snooping around in the marketplace when I saw the video. And I've read up on the moose pumps, more than most people. Now I'm going to search through the posts on waste gate, and non waste gates. I was on the a.t.s website, and they wanted $2100 for the only turbo system that they had to offer for the i.d.i. I'm sure I can find better. Originally my truck came with a 7.3, but I'm 80% sure that the p.o had a half ass 6.9 rebuild put in it. It might have 5000 miles on it now, if it is a rebuilt, not even broke in yet. But I wouldn't think the water pump would go out right away with a decent rebuilt. So it's kind of up in the air.
I would think that the right thing to do is, find a 7.3, have it rebuilt. Or buy a good rebuilt one, and make sure it has the proper sca's. Put the turbo on that, and that way when I blow it up I can throw the old moter back in it so I can still get to work. I know it's not something that's going to happen overnight, but it's within reason to set a goal of 2 years. Thanks for your posts, there's so much more to learn about these trucks. Chances are, I'll be working pipeline this summer in Florida, maybe I'll have a chance to get together. But then again, I'll have to work 7 days a week to pay for all of this.

 

[Diesel JD]

I see, if you have a break and you're not too far away it shouldn't be too much trouble to get together. Now, I wouldn't assume your trauck rebuild was half assed just cause the water pump quit after, maybe they didn't replace it or replaced it with a reman, and not a very decent one. Does make you wonder what other things were done and what other corners may have been cut. My philosophy with these motors is don't go hunting for trouble if it hasn't found you and the motor runs fine. If it starts and runs good with no excessive blowby it's a great candidate for a build. With the 6.9s ARP does offer a specific stud kit and it's not much more than a new set of bolts. If I wanted to push more than 15 psi ever or more than 10-12 consistently I'd certainly stud a 6.9, at least that's the correct answer. Some people might blow a gasket at 6 psi and others have gotten away with 15 psi and up for months or years and no immediately obvious issues.

 

[rckslash2010]

I see, if you have a break and you're not too far away it shouldn't be too much trouble to get together. Now, I wouldn't assume your trauck rebuild was half assed just cause the water pump quit after, maybe they didn't replace it or replaced it with a reman, and not a very decent one. Does make you wonder what other things were done and what other corners may have been cut. My philosophy with these motors is don't go hunting for trouble if it hasn't found you and the motor runs fine.



Ya. I know all about that. I was screwing around one day under the hood. I grabbed end of the fan, and I could wiggle it. So I ran to town and bought a new water pump, and installed it that night. The next day, the left rear wheel bearing went out, leaving me stranded with the wife and kids, with a horse and trailer hooked up. It seems like when I replace something that's going out, something else happens. It's like trying to figure out what's going to go out next, and being wrong. It's kind of like a game of chess.

 

[h2odrx]

ya Drew took that Zf off my hands his wife and family are nice sorry I had to work and didn't get to help much.....

 

[rckslash2010]

My truck has a zf in it, it's supposedly rebuilt too. So I've got one thing going for me. I'm just reading up on the difference of turbos, wastegate, intercooler's. Sounds like i have an other adventure on my hands.

 

[DeepRoots]

The truck boosts differently with the zf5.
With the c6 you could just jam on the skinny pedal.... on my truck with the zf, full throttle just slips the clutch and makes alotta smoke. There is considerable more power tho with a manual and very usable. I have had (and have) many trucks, I would still have to say the 80's ford diesels with a manual trans are the ultimate work truck.

My truck is just an 088 ATS and a moose pump. Everything else was just tinkering until it was perfect.... ie, I've been known to pull over on the road and adjust the timing.

I've got one fella (biofarmer) considering dropping by, I'm always happy to chat and wrench is someones in the neighborhood.... and DieselJD, I've got a 1500sq ft shop now, so I can actually use all those tools I had out in the yard


Drew

 

[plywood]

I've been known to pull over on the road and adjust the timing.

I resemble that comment.

 

[rckslash2010]

I love my manual transmission, I wouldn't have it any other way. I'm pretty good with a clutch. I'm not sure of what you mean by slipping the clutch when you punch it full throttle. That must be from takeoff? Is there any heavier duty clutch that we can put in? I suppose that would be the first thing to go out.
I'm thinking about going with a hypermax, not sure about the inter-cooler though. Maybe I'll go without for a while. I think what I'll do is collect the things I need, then pull the whole motor. That way I can rebuild the oil cooler, more for a piece of mind. I want to find some better exhaust heads too, mine are looking pretty rusted, and I would like to find some with better flow. And with the motor out everything will be a lot easier to get to. Maybe I'll even throw some fresh paint on everything too.
I had a thought earlier. I could sell my hay-baler, and buy a brand new hypermax. And enough money left over for the exhaust. Then I could sell my tractor, and have enough money for the inner-cooler and everything else that I want to do to the truck. Gear splitter, air lockers, replace the body parts that are rusty, and a really good paint job. I should have enough money left over for a security deposit and rent for a new place, after the wife kicks me out. Pretty good idea, huh?

 

[dyoung14]

ie, I've been known to pull over on the road and adjust the timing.

I have done the same thing