Okay, I did it, Ignorant question #1

[cpm]

When I was in the service, they said the only stupid question was the one you didn't ask.
This isn't true. Usually the stupid question is the one I asked.


that said, I did it. My own fault, no one to blame by myself.

On about the 4th trip in my new old '86 F250 flatbed, 6.9, auto, 2wd,
I was coming up the mountain, felt her surge a bit, , , twice. As i'm
not used to the truck yet, the surge didn't instantly translate into 'LEAN!'

As I turned up the final 2 mile straight 12% grade, she lost power, then it clicked,
and in a panic, I switched tanks, but it was too late.

Couple of hours later, i had her sitting back in the yard.

Now what do I do? How does an idiot recover from running out of fuel?

Never had anything more than a 4cyl diesel before this, like the old VW or that
3 cyl in the tractor. All I did to those was crack the line at the top of the injector
and spin till they weep, move to the next, until it starts, then finish off the last
one or two.

??

 

[GaPchNCrm]

I'm no expert by any means lol but I have ran mine out once. All I did was put fuel in the tank, take the fuel filter off and fill it up too, and she fired back up.

 

[Diesel Fly]

The procedure is really the same that you are already used to. You have to have a good fuel supply (obvious) and you have to bleed the air out of the system. You'll basically have to crank it while systematically bleeding the air out, all the way to the injectors. Chances are that it'll run before you get that far.

You'll need a buddy and some well charged batteries. A good place to start bleeding is at the schrader valve on the fuel filter head. Works just like a tire valve - press it in while someone cranks the engine. Bleed until fuel comes out.

Eventually she'll run again.

 

[Darrin Tosh]

Welcome to the site, as Tany said, fill up the fuel filter. Then take a 5/8" wrench and crack open about 4 or 5 of the lines going into the injectors. Just turn them about 1/2 of a turn. Then crank the engine over about 20 seconds, and let it sit for a minute so you don't overheat the starter. Continue this process untill you see diesel fuel bubbling out of the top of the injecter fitting the line goes it. Once you see fuel there, retighten the lines and it will start right up.

The fuel guages didn't work very well on my first diesel that I had so I was able to practice this a few times!

 

[Agnem]

Bet the next time is surges, you'll remember what that means.

 

[cpm]

Wow!

Thanks for all the quick and insightful replies.

Okay, I got it.

I do have fuel at the filter, I sorta checked that first, and squirted fuel all over
my $DAY_JOB clothes. Perfect. I love the smell of diesel.

It was my own dumb luck I guess, I didn't really know these things would eat
starters like crunchy breakfast cerel. Stands to reason I suppose. Other, considerably
lighter diesels I've messed with would crank till the cows got bored, as long as
you had battery. This big ole monster is quite different. I'd have thought the starter
motor would be up to it. Good to know. I didn't overcrank it, mostly because I
wasn't keen on giving up what battery I had.

Well, I'll give her another go this evening.

Thanks again for the help.


And Mel;
Yessir, I will

 

[MIDNIGHT RIDER]

In it's over half-a-million miles, I ran my old 6.9 out of fuel, countless times, not out of neglect, so much, rather than the fact that my big auxilliary tank has no gauge.

These engines (6.9 anyway) are SELF-BLEEDING.

There is no reason to "crack a line" or "bleed" anything.

I never did anything but switch to a tank that had fuel and crank the engine.

In a few seconds, she would start hitting, then she would fire, bleed out, and run.

The starter that International screwed on there in 1985 is still on there, with never a wrench ever being on a bolt, believe it or not.

Of course, I never cranked more than half-a-minute at a time, with a half-a-minute rest between.

Usually, before the first half-minute, it would already be running.

If your engine will not start, without bleeding and messing with the filter, you better check the health of your lift-pump and injector-pump.

 

[Michael Fowler]

cpm,
First of all, Welcome!" You have already discovered that THIS is the site for help.
Secondly, this is as good a time as any to make standard speech#2.
Install an electric fuel pump, and by-pass the mechanical one on the engine. There are several benefits to this:
Easily primes the fuel system when you change fuel filters--or at other times as required.
Makes finding pesky fuel leaks easier.
Eliminates most leaks of air INTO the fuel lines. Traditional cause of hard starting.
Eliminates that nasty mess when the fuel pump diaphram rutures and pumps gallons of #2 diesel into the crankcase.
End of speech

Standard speech#1 is about replacing the oem glow plug control system.
Standard speech #3 is about reading all the IDI tech articles. DO THIS!

Oh, and again WELCOME!!!!!!

 

[MIDNIGHT RIDER]

Install an electric fuel pump, and by-pass the mechanical one on the engine. There are several benefits to this:
Easily primes the fuel system when you change fuel filters--or at other times as required.
Makes finding pesky fuel leaks easier.
Eliminates most leaks of air INTO the fuel lines. Traditional cause of hard starting.
Eliminates that nasty mess when the fuel pump diaphram rutures and pumps gallons of #2 diesel into the crankcase.

This is sound advice and can even be a cheapie electric-pump, in a valved by-pass line, that you only use when a situation develops.


I have replaced the DIAPHRAGM lift-pump, on my Cummins engine, with the far superior PISTON-TYPE mechanical lift-pump.

There is no way for a piston-pump to leak fuel into the crank-case, as it has no diaphragm.

The piston-pump screws into the same location that the diaphragm pump came out of, using the same bolts/gaskets.


Does anyone know if there is a PISTON LIFT-PUMP available for the International engines, possibly from a heavier truck application ??

The diaphragm pumps on both the old 6.9 and the Cummins, produced about six PSI on my in-dash fuel-pressure gauge.

The piston-pump holds a pretty steady sixteen PSI.

Another bit of advice for everyone is INSTALL A FUEL-PRESSURE GAUGE, down-stream of the filter, better yet, have two, one ahead and one behind the filter.

 

[cpm]

I
These engines (6.9 anyway) are SELF-BLEEDING.

There is no reason to "crack a line" or "bleed" anything.

hmmm, , , that's kinda disappointing to hear. I was wishing
that was true when I was stuck on that grade. I'm very sorry
to hear that. As she won't start. She ran, i ran her out of fuel,
switched tanks (to a tank that is full, and worked last week)
and she won't start. Fuel at the filter for sure.

I
If your engine will not start, without bleeding and messing with the filter, you better check the health of your lift-pump and injector-pump.

hmmm again;
Well the injector-pump is new-ish. Meaning the fellow I bought it from replaced it,
twice in short order, -seems that's common- shortly before he sold her to me.
There's a nice, clean, fresh looking pump sitting there, clean, new filter, nice new
line, all that.
I've only 'run to town' with it a few times, since I got it inspected. Up to Pa twice. I've run 5 tanks of fuel though her (would be on tank 6 if I had been quicker to pay attention). A lot of work up on the mountain, moving lumber around and such, and she always starts
at first crack, every time. This is a bit scary.

since I have fuel at the filter, ,
dunno what to think now.

 

[Freight_Train]

yea,I ran mine outta fuel in the plant parking lot a few years ago....(Ok,Ok,Going on a decade since it ain't moved under it's own power in a several year...)I just switched tanks,hit the starter for 30 seconds.....waited about a minute,hit it again....wait........Hit it again and she lit off although sounded real rough smokey and shook for a few seconds while the air got purged from the lines.

 

[Michael Fowler]

cpn,
I've discovered that one place for a leak to develop is the fuel line INTO the IP. I had a leak, and replaced the seal, and its leaking again. A leak at that point will certainly suck air. These engines will not run on just air,

 

[MIDNIGHT RIDER]

cpn,
I've discovered that one place for a leak to develop is the fuel line INTO the IP. I had a leak, and replaced the seal, and its leaking again. A leak at that point will certainly suck air. These engines will not run on just air,

If you are meaning that short line that goes from the filter-head to the center of the injector-lines, at the cab-facing end of the injector-pump, several years ago, I had a bear of a time getting it to quit leaking.

I probably had that line off a hundred times.

I replaced seal after seal and finally found a hair-line crack through the flanged end of that tube, at the injector-pump end.

I bought a new line and no more leak.

If I were to have to do it again, I would do away with that low-pressure hard-line and replace it with a flexible line.

Hard fuel lines don't hold up very well to the vibrations of a diesel engine.

 

[Michael Fowler]

There really is no reason for that line to be a steel, hard line is there.

 

[h2odrx]

Hey welcome to the site, and how much fuel is in the tank? it may need a new filter?