Busted!

[RustyRecycledT]

Last week I drove the truck to work because I needed to haul home some barrels. While I was loading the barrels I noticed the tone of the exhaust changed and I could smell raw fuel. Popped the hood for a peak and there is fuel spraying out the side of the IP. Seems the lever running to the advance on the bottom of the IP broke in two and allowed the 'guts' to puke out the side of the pump. That was on Thursday
Friday I picked up a new (rebuilt) IP from a local diesel shop and gave my bro in law a call. (He's a diesel mechanic)

saturday evening when he got off work we made the 70 mile drive to the truck to make repairs.
Our goal was new IP,new valley pan,new glow plugs.

Everything went fine Saturday. Monday I took the truck to the shop where I bought the IP and had it timed. Truck has never run better!

Fast forward to yesterday. Had the wife drive me to work (70 miles) so I could drive the truck home. About 1/2 way home I looked in the mirror and noticed i was dragging a strap from the barrels so I pulled over and restrapped it.
Got back in the cab, waited for a gap in traffic (4 lane divided highway). Started accelerating down the shoulder to merge into traffic, all of a sudden I heard a 'POP' (like it backfired) and the truck died. Would not start at all. Wouldn't even fire on WD-40.

While I was waiting on the wrecker I did some nosing around. Had a crazy hunch and pulled the oil spout off. 2 of the 3 bolts that are supposed to be bolted into my IP are in the cover. The third one is loose as hell. Seems that the bro in law forgot to tighten them.

So, now the truck is home, and broke. I have no clue where to start. Me and the truck need to be in Dallas next weekend.

Anyone got any suggestions for me?

 

[Exekiel69]

If he made a mark on the IP You could try to move the pump to the same position and tighten it back if nothing is broken yet it should start.

Btw I read somewhere that the wd-40 is not the same as before so it wouldn't start the engine anyway.

 

[icanfixall]

I feel your talking about the small bolts that are behind the oil fill cover. If so those can be bought at Hectorwithinjectors... He is in Arizona. Most any injection rebuilt shop will have them. Also they are the same bolt as the rear u-joint are and Nappa sells them. I don't have the part number but some body may chime in. The gear can't jump timing so thats good. Now you need to remove the broken bolts. It will run again...

 

[94f450sd]

2 of the 3 bolts that are supposed to be bolted into my IP are in the cover. ?

do you have those 2 bolts in your hand or do you mean they are lost somewhere in the cover?

 

[david85]

If they fell out, they are probably in the oil pan. Just hope the timing gears didn't try and chew any of them on their way down.

 

[RustyRecycledT]

I have the 2 bolts in hand. They didn't break off, they backed out.One of them was pretty chewed up so i went to O'Reillys a bit ago and bought some u-joint bolts that were virtually identical.

The third bolt that was still in there was only in by about 3 threads. It was about to fall out.

I'm guess I must still be dizzy from sitting in the 100* heat for three and a half hours waiting for either my wife to show up with some water or the rollback to show up. I just can't wrap my head around why, if it 'cant' jump time, it wouldn't run with one bolt and a dowel pin still in place.

I'm gonna wander out and install my new bolts and see what happens, although my hopes are not very high at this point. My brother in law is still not returning my calls. I believe that will probably be the last time I let a certified mechanic touch my truck.

 

[david85]

I believe that will probably be the last time I let a certified mechanic touch my truck.

Been there myself. The only work you can really trust is the work you did yourself.

It will probably just be a matter of standard troubleshooting of the problem. Check the FSS, check for fuel at the injectors, and so on.

 

[RustyRecycledT]

Well, new bolts installed. Cracked open the injector line on #2 (easiest to get to & see while jumping solenoid).

Engine cranks over....no fuel coming from injector line.

While cranking I do have fuel at the schrader valve. Just nothing at the injector.
FSS IS clicking when I plug & unplug it.

I think I've narrowed it down to being IP related. (of some sort)
wonder how happy the diesel shop is going to be about covering a new one under warranty if need be. They told me 1 year warranty. I've had it a week and put 42 miles on it.

I've got a couple friends coming over shortly to help me drag the beast into my shop building so I can work on it in there. Guess I'm going to pull the IP and see if it broke a shaft or something.

 

[typ4]

Pump shaft is possibly broke from the gear cocking.

Being an experienced mechanic, I have nothing against the certified ones but all that really means is you can read and pass the test. I know because I have a good buddy that did this. Another term that is misused/overused is "technician", what is an automotive "technician"??

 

[punkmechanic]

rustyrecylcedt sorry to here about all this. havent had my pump apart to see what is on the inside but i would agree that it is most likely in the pump. Take it back and make them warranty it. Sorry to hear your in law is a certified mechanic. I am a certified technition myself. The difference is in the attention to detail and training. I do agree that ceritified only mean you can pass a test, being a technition means you better know your s*it or your gonna get called out for it in a hurry. I have access to ford parts just over cost, good techs to ask if you have a question I cant answer and some shop manuals. let me know if I can be of help. Not all certified techs are bad.

 

[RLDSL]

don't forget to put a few drops of med strength locktite on those new bolts and torque to spec if you don't want a repeat performance

There's a very good chance that the shaft in the pump got cracked if it was rattling around in there. If you loosened all the injector lines and got no fuel while cranking, that's not a good sign, especially since that was a fresh pump.

I used to be a certified mechanic WAY back before it was cool ( back when the ase thingy had a few more initials on it, but that got too confusing for these young guys ...now I'm just certifiable

What part of the state are you hiding in? With you , that makes about 5 or 6 of us rattling around here, all spread out though. I'm near the River by Toad Suck

 

[RustyRecycledT]

Well, brother in law showed up last night. To be honest, he really is a good mechanic....on much larger engines. Detroits,Cats,M-B,etc. He swears up and down he tightened the bolts. Even says he remembered when he tightened them he slid a wrench over the handle of the ratchet for extra leverage. (overkill)

At any rate, we pulled the IP last night. There is no doubt the shaft is busted. As for what caused it? Not sure. The nuts on the frontside were loose as well. Which means when they timed the pump they didn't get them tight either.

At this point it's anybodys guess as to what caused it.

I pulled out my receipt for the pump, I had written the mileage on it when the pump was installed. I made it a whopping 51 miles before the pump died. For what that thing cost I expect more than 51 miles.
They told me when I picked it up I had a 1 year warrantee as long as there was no water or gasoline. specifically asked if turning the pump up would void the warranty and they said no. So tomorrow morning i'll be walking into their shop with a busted pump looking for a replacement.

Am I being out of line expecting them to retime it as well at no charge?

As for where I'm rattling around, South of Branson,MO just across the line around Harrison. There are a few of us up here. My bro in law is one of us in his '92 F-350. Although all he does is drive it. When we have a family get together it look slike an IDI rally. IDIs lined up in a row, guys sitting around talking about what they did to their trucks since the last get together.

 

[icanfixall]

They better stand behind their work and... They are required to retime it because they left the nuts loose. The torque on those 3 5/16 bolts is 25 lbs. Make sure you get that and clean the threads in the gear so the loctite will hold....

 

[typ4]

Having the mounting bolts loose will also loosen up the gear bolts. I know this one first hand.

I am not condemning all technicians or certified mechanics because there are some very good ones out there. I am sorry to offend.
What it boils down to is ,If you are really into being a mechanic, you will probably be a good one. And the attention to detail is THE most important thing in doing the job right.
Also if you are doing any amount of work in any field you WILL make some errors along the way.
I have the pleasure of troubleshooting failure causes at work on airport equipment ,from diesel's, gas, little transmissions and axles ,to BIG ones that really mess up stuff when they break.
Guess what the most frequent cause is?? No oil or water!, I love the engine with the rod knock that is full of brand new oil, "oh it just started to rattle"!
Sorry for the rant, I been doing this too long.

 

[RustyRecycledT]

I am not condemning all technicians or certified mechanics because there are some very good ones out there. I am sorry to offend.
What it boils down to is ,If you are really into being a mechanic, you will probably be a good one. And the attention to detail is THE most important thing in doing the job right.
Also if you are doing any amount of work in any field you WILL make some errors along the way.

No offense taken. We all make mistakes. In retrospect, I was probably throwing my broinlaw under the bus a bit on this one. Since he was the one who installed it. Now, I'm not so much thinking that it was his fault per se.
When I went to remove the mounting nuts on the housing all I did was touch the ones on the bottom with a wrench and they started
turning. No resistance at all.

I know what you mean about attention to detail. I've been a body/paint man for 20 years now. I've had the mispleasure of working with many techs who didn't follow procedure,took shortcuts,didn't pay attention to detail. 6 months after they get fired for too many complaints from customers guess who gets to repaint their screwups.
I'm not claiming to be perfect by any means. I screw up too, even after 20 years of doing it. Sometimes it just happens that there is a failure of some sort that is beyond anyones control.

Perhaps the pump they sold me already had a crack or weakness of some sort in the shaft. How would the shop I bought it from know? They didn't rebuild it inhouse. They get them from a supplier.

We'll see tomorrow how well they stand behind what they sell. I've got to get the truck running before the weekend though, we've got to be in Texas to pick up my most recent purchase on Saturday. '84 M-B 300D