Resealing plate behind water pump

[IDIoit]

What's the easiest way to lift the fuel pump gear cover
Without pulling the pump and messing with my timing?
I know the IP should be treated like a distributor.
With the cover off and pin located before lifting it up.
Just looking for some tricks to make this easy as possible.

I'm also swapping the t-19 out tomorrow for a zf5,
addressing the fuel pick ups. and swapping beds
Taking my serp set up to get blasted so I can paint it.
Rebuilding driveshafts and changing diff fluids.

Long list of stuff to do.

You must be registered for see images attach

You must be registered for see images attach

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[The Warden]

Which cover are you pulling? Are you pulling the injector pump drive gear cover, or are you pulling the timing gear cover?

If you're pulling off the timing gear cover (the big plate that the water pump bolts onto), you're actually okay...you can leave the IP drive gear cover on (the timing cover plate goes into a slot on the IP drive gear cover), or if you want to reseal that also, you can pull it without any trouble; just leave the pump bolted firmly in the same spot, then make sure the gears are aligned after putting the IP drive gear cover on and before you put the timing gear cover on, and your timing shouldn't be altered any. With the timing gear cover off, get the dots on the crank gear and the cam gear aligned, then the Y stamp on the cam gear aligned with the Y stamp on the IP gear.

If you want to only pull the IP drive gear cover, it's really not safe to do with the timing gear cover installed...too good of a chance of getting the timing off on the gear, and if it's even off by one tooth, re-timing the engine's going to be next to impossible...

 

[icanfixall]

Kind of difficult to understand what you have in mind to do but tim covers it well. your going to find the aluminum injection pump gear cover has an RTV seal under it. Also that front plate that covers all the gears fits up into that aluminum gear cover. Cleaning out ALL the RTV may be impossible with it still on the block. Removing the injection pump and gear cover as one piece CAN be done safely too. You will find 2 different gaskets on each side of the block under this plate too. Clean both surfaces well with brakeclean. At the bottom seal to the oil pan is a couple of bolts under it too. Don't forget to remove them or the plate wont come off. Clean that area well too because the oil pan to block to plate will leak if not completely cleaned. RTV is the gasket for the oil pan and the plate seal down there. Use enough to see it squeeze out well enough to make a bulge. Cut it off later when it hardens with a razor or exacto knife if you want to. Now is a good time to make sure those 4 water pump bolt nuts are not stripped. You will see them on the back side of the plate. If they are stripped its best to weld a stud on the back side. The you have an alignment stud when the pump is replaced next time. The gears are very close to the thin nuts. Thats why they are so thin. Be careful if you weld a stud or replace those nuts. Why they are so soft I can't say but I have seen some that strip out. Here is what the gears look like when timed to number 1 at tdc. Notice the Cam gear has a "Y" and a"." for marks. The DOT goes with the crank and the "Y" goes with the injection pump gear. The crank gear has half as many teeth as the cam and the injection pump gear. Both of the cam and injection pump gears have the same amount of teeth. Your going to need a special damper remover installer too. Tip is to make sure when the damper bolt and washer are reinstalled you use a dot of RTV on the keyway to crank area. If nothing is used oil sure will leak out of the keyway slot past the tightened washer. You may see just a small bit of the factory RTV on there when you remove it too.

You must be registered for see images attach

You must be registered for see images attach

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[IDIoit]

sorry for being unclear, it was at the end of a long night. IPA's and medication.
i want to reseal the plate behind the water pump.
from what i see, the timing gear cover looks like it needs to be lifted slightly to take this plate off.
from what i read, i can slide this plate out without messing with the cover.
am i correct?

appreciate the tip about using RTV on the keyway, i would have missed that for sure

 

[jaluhn83]

Take the whole cover and pump off - this way you can seal it properly.

You can remove the lines, pump to gear bolts & pump to housing bolts and just slide the pump back without actually taking the whole thing off. But, the injection gear cover and gear needs to come off. Once you have the front cover off you can verify the timing marks and mark the teeth on the cam gear to line the pump gear back up. The injection gear cover seals to the block and front cover with RTV, so the only way to reseal it properly is to take the cover off, clean the old RTV and redo the RTV seal. Not worth the risk of leakage to mess around with no doing it right.

 

[hesutton]

There is not a good way to remove that timing gear cover with the IP gear cover on the block. The top lip of the timing cover fits up into the IP gear cover. There are two dowel pins for the timing cover as well. These two things (the dowels and IP cover overlap) will make removing that with the IP cover on a nightmare.

Much easier to remove the IP cover. Trying to fight the timing cover off and then back on over new gakets is a recipe for another leak behind that gear cover.

You want your gears to look exactly like the ones in Gary's picture above. Put your new gaskets with RTV on both side on the block. Have a nice bead of RTV where the cover meets the oil pan. Put the timing cover on and bolt it down. Then put the IP gear cover on.

Just don't move the IP gear until you get it's housing back on the top of the block. Once that IP gear cover is on, that gear should not jump time.

Heath

 

[IDIoit]

thanks everyone for your help.
what id really like to do is to remove the pump and clean up the cover too.
am i correct in assuming (without making an ass out of you and me, but more of myself)
if i align the gears and dowel pin like the picture above, and center punch my mark from the cover to the IP,
i can safely get this thing back to the correct timing its at now?
right now its 7* @ 2000 rpms, and 14 at idle, towcat timed it for me a couple of months ago.
id like to avoid taking that trip again.
nothing aginst towcat, he did a great job, but towing this rig 2 hrs away was sketchy with the
POS trailer i have

 

[BDCarrillo]

One tip to keep the pump gear from moving is to use two bolts through the pump mount bolt cover to "clamp" the gear in place. As long as you don't spin the crank (so pull the balancer first), alignment won't change.

Two bolts 5/16-18NC, 1-1/4" long

 

[icanfixall]

Timing can be reset easily if you just do this one thing. BEFORE you remove the injection pump from the aluminum gear cover just make a center punch mark in the housing to injection pump joint line. Now when you have a round mark in that line and the pump is removed you end up with a 1/2 round on the pump and on the housing. Match up those marks as one round mark and your back where you started for timing. But please remove the pump from the housing and gear. Clean out the housing seal area of the factory RTV. Clean off the block. Install the gear as my pics shows. Then install the front cover. Then the top gear housing. The explanation and job can't be any simpler than that.

 

[IDIoit]

You must be registered for see images attach

So, that wasn't as bad as I thought!
Got it all stripped down, clean, painted
I found a gasket for the timing cover.
Always feel better about using gaskets than just RTV
should be here within the hour

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[icanfixall]

Might not be a good idea painting the fan clutch especially the spring in front of it. They need to give up heat. The spring controls how the clutch locks up by expanding and turning that center valve shaft. Nice looking but color may not be what you want. Try it and see how it works. the post back results.

 

[IDIoit]

Well after spending a half a day on her today,
I got her to fire up again. Sounds like her normal self!
And looks a bit better.
Now I just need to get a new alt, AC compressor, and air pump.
She will look pretty clean!

Still need to put the PS. Pulley clutch and fan, radiator, and bed.

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[riotwarrior]

Looks quite nice...

Now question where bouts u locate front plate gaskets? and HOW MUCH?

I think I'm in need of 5 more gaskets....REAR main seal cover front cover gaskets and water pump and tstat...

That gives me full on every gasket I need.

Hope that you get it timed and running like it should!

 

[IDIoit]

I paid 25 bux for a good felpro 2 piece timing cover gasket, came with a front balancer seal, water pump gasket, and for no reason at all, a lift pump gasket. Got it from monument.
She's back to the settings I started off with.
Got the gears lined up, and the IP back to the same spot she came off of.

I took all of this apart because my lower radiator housing was leaking.
So I decided to do the whole damned thing vs. doing it again later.
Plus I needed a coolant flush anyways!

 

[cpdenton]

Sounds like a classic case of, "while I'm in there..."

I tend to do the same thing. Looks like you are on the downhill side. Sure is nice to have everything clean after you do this type of work too. Looks good!