Wastegate or non wastegated part II

Ok, so i really like the idi so i have decidced not to put a cummins in it. I dont want a competition truck i just want to be able to MAINTAIN speed on long steep hills pulling my usual 5-6k load. I hate losing 35mph by the top of a 2 mile hill. If i hit it at 60 at the bottom i want to do 60 at the top.

That leads me to turboing the IDI. I know that each turbo setup has its pros and cons. I just want to know what is best for my application.

I use the truck to tow my rockcrawler. It very very rarely gets driven in town and it never gets driven unloaded. It is an F350 dually so occasionally i have some heavy stuff on the flatbed.

I need my power on hills, not necessarily going down the flat interstate. I have to pull 2 6%+ grades that are 2 miles each, every time i go 4wheeling. Sometimes i can hit the bottom with speed sometimes i cant.My truck is a 5spd with 4.10s and is 2wd. I have plenty of stump pulling power off the line, but once i get moving it needs more oomph. BUT i dont want turbo lag like my stock 97 stroke work truck has. It doesnt boost until 2500 rpm and by the time it boosts its time to shift again.

Thanks again for all the help.

Will

I prefer wastegated, some dont. you can in theory make more boost at the top with a non, but as we all know you need it down low where mine works good. ATS 093 with a bigger comp wheel.

russ please check your ***

yea i hear the wastegated keep the turbo spooled longer while shifting. the non lose the boost while shifting.

-Jon

Wastegated turbo will help you get moving because they spool sooner, but once you are under load on those hills, they won't make any difference because you won't be lugging up those hills anyway. EGTs are also slightly higher than non wastegated though probably not by enough to really matter.

Your comment about the non gated stroker turbo leads me to think you might be one of those people who would be upset with the performance of a non gated. I like my 088 non gated but the boost doesn't come on until closer to 2000RPM and you don't get much till you get closer to 2500-3000. It really helps but you'd have it sooner with a wastegated unit.

I usually sum it up this way... get a wastegated if you do a lot of city or stop and go driving. Get a non if you want highway cruising. Look at it this way, your towing your rig up a hill at 60 MPH. With a wastegated turbo, your waste gate is open, a lot of your boost is going out the exhaust, and your EGT's are higher due to the extra work which is now being wasted. With a non-wastegated, 100% of your exhaust is being used efficiently, and the limit to the boost you can make is set by your foot and your pump. With my 2 hypermax units, I don't really notice any loss of power when shifting. Boost builds pretty quick.

What if you eliminated the wastegate by capping it off? You wouldn't have any wasted exhaust gasses and you'll be more like a non wastegated.

91crew said:

What if you eliminated the wastegate by capping it off? You wouldn't have any wasted exhaust gasses and you'll be more like a non wastegated.

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I've seen that before and bad things happen. It is popular to use a stiffer wastegate spring or a larger diaphram on some turbo's to allow the wastegate to open under more pressure--building more boost, but to eliminate it's function altogether will really effect it's effeciency or damage the turbocharger altogether.

91crew said:

What if you eliminated the wastegate by capping it off? You wouldn't have any wasted exhaust gasses and you'll be more like a non wastegated.

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It would overspeed the turbo because the wheel dia. is a lot smaller on the WG . Bad idea for the most part, now if you were a town delivery truck it would be ok.

Zukinut

I love it when someone asks to check for ***

...Anyway...

One suggestion for you. Instead of trying to reinvent the wheel, start looking at signatures here and see who has a similar rig to yours. PM them (don't *** them...Nobody likes that ) and find out what has worked for them. There has to be folks here with a tonner 2wd that are pulling loads. Old Mister Bill may be a good resource for you, although he pulled using a e4od. He's a wealth of knowledge when it comes to hauling with an IDI.

I've pulled with a wastegated banks setup. I like it. I have not pulled with a non gated unit, so I can't comment on that. If I enter a hill with less than 5 pounds of manifold pressure the setup is less than stellar. The only time this happens is if I end up starting out close to the hill. If I can maintain speed coming into a hill manifold pressure is always 5 or more and I can maintain speed throughout the hill. My setup is a lot different than yours. I'm running 3.54s and a 4 speed. I also have an intercooler.

I have a good friend running a 3/4 ton 2wd with 4.10s and a 4 speed (no turbo). His rig will do 60mph all day long with a load. Since you're planning to do it anyway and it's easier to do before the turbo install, it wouldn't be a bad idea to start with the IP and injectors. You can always turn the fuel up if you go with a turbo.

Good luck with your project. I'm glad you decided to stay with the IDI.

Paul

if you like running the nuts off your truck get a non wastegated, but if youd like to go the same speed with less fuel get a wastegated setup. I have not used a hypermax setup and im sure they work much better than my turbo. I do all my towing over big passes and would trade my turbo for a bone **** stock factory turbo any day

For highway hauling with a load, a non wastegated works great . When I'm pulling my 5er in the hills, I have no problem at all building boost instantly even when I have to shift a gear, boost is right there. When you have that much load on, it spools up fast. The key is a wide open exhaust and a pump turned up just enough , but not too much. ( it's a fine line, just right =power, too much, just excess smoke and bogs down, not enough, and it will be lacking)

My 5er weighs 10k and my carhauler weighs 8k empty and I drag these around the Ozarks so I am familiar with your situation and I have 4.10 and a zf5, I can build all the boost I could ever use very quickly, the steeper the hill, the faster the boost comes on. In other words, it's there when you really need it.

Couldn't have said it better. With my non gates setup I have boost when the engine's working hard, pulling a hill or going fast, accelerating to get on the interstate. Drives like NA most of the rest of the time around town. I have the pump turned up but not a lot. If I stand on it I can hit 9-10 psi empty real quick! But since I have reused stock bolts, relatively little money and don't like too much smoke or speeding tickets this is a rare event. This is empty by the way, the turbo boosts better with some load.

My ol' ATS 085 non-gated starts spooling between 1,700-1,900 rpms depending on the acceleration. I have a C6, 4.10 gears, and 315 (35") tires. I can hit 9-10 psi on acceleration and maintain 7-8 psi through the shifts. Mine gives me all the power I need currently. I have the pump turned up two flats too. Once money allows it, my truck will get the IC installed, head studs, a new IP, and injectors so that I can see what it will really do.