wmo causing metering valve to stick?

[Christian9112]

So I tried running a batch of 50/50 wmo that had been sitting for 7 months (wmo not diesel). starts right up but when I blip the throttle, the engine drops rpm too far and stalls out. I tried driving it and it would die if I let go of the throttle too fast. When It got in to WOT it ran ok. Every time it stalled It started right up. No power steering and no brake booster is a little scary tho. I've done a lot of research through the forums and it's looking like the IP metering valve is sticking. I tried flushing it with diesel kleen winterizing fuel in a new fuel filter and it seems to be ok now. I did try it in the afternoon at around 70 f. My question is, does the diagnosis match the problem? if so, is it a permanent damage? I have no knowledge in the IP department.

Engine info:
275k miles.
Original IP
15k miles delphi injectors.
Regulated black holley pump.
N/A

Im looking to buy R&D pump but he is always out of stock.

 

[Thewespaul]

Yep, likely the wmo is too thick and causing the metering valve to stick. Justin (R&D) isn’t out of stock, he’s just not producing any pumps right now or for the last 6 months. He had issues with the fuel shop he had been using and is in the process of getting setup with a stand of his own and learning how to do it himself. The R&D pumps will come back just gonna take some time, he’s not going to rush it and end up with pumps having issues he would rather not sell any while he gets everything dialed in, understandably. I can build you a pump to whatever spec you need, since you’re na you can’t use a whole lot more than stock 5070 cal, but there’s nothing like a fresh pump.

 

[Christian9112]

Wes always there for the people! I keep seeing justin's name and injection pump come out in the same sentence. I want to see how well his name stands up. Can you build a 90cc pump? I remember asking you for a quote once but I wanted to wait until R&D pumps were available. Is it possible to have a better metering valve to run on a little thicker oil? like adding a stronger spring or something. I am also planning on putting a heat plate exchanger to heat up the wmo. In your opinion, is it healthy for the IP to run at 180f with or without wmo?

 

[Thewespaul]

This is the metering valve, there’s no springs it’s just a angle cut slug that’s in a machined bore in the pump head. It sticks when it can’t move freely in its bore, usually because of a fuel contamination issue. But too thick of a fuel will do it too.

You must be registered for see images attach

You must be registered for see images attach

I can build up to 150cc now, and I’m working on a db4 for a customer that will really be pushing the limits, I keep 90cc pumps on the shelf because they are my most selling pump, $850 shipped.

 

[Christian9112]

thanks wes. ill catch you on my next paycheck.

 

[Alwaysreadyrob]

just heat the WMO to thin it out, that also lets it spray out of the injectors the same way diesel does

 

[bbjordan]

Check/replace your fuel filter. I had similar problems with a dirty fuel filter.

I run a 85% WMO, 10% RUG, 5% Biodiesel mix, and have no problems in warm weather. I don't run it below freezing temps, because it gives me problems.

How clean is your WMO? I run mine thru a PA BIODIESEL 65 gallon per hour centrifuge, and I run it until until no more crud comes out. Some batches (45 US gallons) have taken 48 hrs. of centrifuge time! I'm getting more picky about my WMO sources now.

Edit, I see you put a new fuel filter in, and it seems ok now. That might have been the problem. Hopefully it was. Nothing like a cheap and easy fix.

 

[Alwaysreadyrob]

what kind of pump runs that centrifuge ?
i have a redline pump and looking for a centrifuge.... how much was it ?

 

[subway]

i run my centrifuge with an old honda power steering pump

 

[bbjordan]

I also run an old Honda power steering pump. It's turned by a an old washing machine motor.

The pump & motor:

You must be registered for see images attach

The system. The barrel in the foreground has R16 insulation with a blue tarp wrapped around it:

You must be registered for see images attach

After 8 hours of 'fuging:

You must be registered for see images attach

Close up:

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[Black dawg]

Wes always there for the people! I keep seeing justin's name and injection pump come out in the same sentence. I want to see how well his name stands up. Can you build a 90cc pump? I remember asking you for a quote once but I wanted to wait until R&D pumps were available. Is it possible to have a better metering valve to run on a little thicker oil? like adding a stronger spring or something. I am also planning on putting a heat plate exchanger to heat up the wmo. In your opinion, is it healthy for the IP to run at 180f with or without wmo?[/QUOTE

I wouldn't worry about heating a 50/50 mix, but do get it as clean as possible. I always filtered to 2 micron, and then also 2 micron filter on the truck.

 

[Christian9112]

Centrifuge is my next project. My wmo is basically straight out of the engine syntethic oil. mercedes dealer oil changes. i did run the barrel with a 5 micron sock. my truck has aftermarket cat filters.I think the oil and diesel mix was just too thick. bbjordan, I saw your setup on youtube during my research months ago. it looks great! how do you guys heat your wmo on your truck to run it smoothly? I dont want to use RUG to thin it out. I dont want it to vapor lock.

 

[Saev]

Talk about a small world. I'm stuck in a hotel in MT because of the same issue of the truck stalling out letting off throttle. Just under 100k on the odometer and, far as I know, still on the original IP. I had to have my truck towed to a shop in town so they can look it over Monday AM since the issue didn't occur until late day yesterday. Tail end of a 2 week work trip between WA, CA and MT.

So either fuel filter or IP....simple/cheap or simple /expensive...at least it's simple.

 

[Macrobb]

One 'workaround' for sticky metering valve / dying letting off the throttle is to find the "guide stud" at the back of the IP. It's usually under a red/gray "do not tamper" cover.
Loosen the jam nut/seal nut on that stud, and use an allen wrench to screw in the "guide stud" as far as you can. Tighten the seal nut again.

This will increase the "governor response" basically - it'll make it more sensitive, and also means that the governor picks up earlier and won't let it die nearly so easily.
Idle will also be higher, you may have to adjust.

Again, this is just a workaround - it probably won't drive quite right(take some getting used to), but it'll certainly get you down the road.

 

[bbjordan]

how do you guys heat your wmo on your truck to run it smoothly?

I don't heat mine.