WMO and short distance drives...?

[AcIdBuRn02ZTS]

Well... I will find out here soon. I ordered all the fittings I need to plumb the fphe.. and I'll swap out the lift pump at the same time.

I got the 20 plate heat exchanger from duda diesel a while back... never installed it. I picked up a modded piston style lift pump kit from Hungry Diesel... takes a high pressure high volume stock lift pump from the 94+ 5.9 and runs a custom regulator spring... from talking to other people running this setup on their 4bt engines, with the 15psi spring, they cant get fuel pressure to even flutter under 15 under any condition...

Everything should be here wed.

 

[AcIdBuRn02ZTS]

In thinking about it... the heat exchanger won't do anything for short trips... as it won't have time to get warm.

I believe the stock tank will stick with a maximum of 10% w80 if not straight d2 for startup, warm up, and shutdown. I'll keep the 20 gallon cell for strictly w80.. switch over once at operating temp.

Just insight for others... short trips on wmo blends is not a good idea. Oil needs heat to burn clean.

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[JSVD]

running WMO or WVO while your engine isn't at temperature is harmful. The WVO or WMO will simply deposit more coking. If all you do is blend your WMO, odds are you're depositing more coking than Diesel already... nothing major but it is shortening the life of your engine. Coking is caused by the fuel not being the same viscosity as diesel, as well as not having the same flash point... leading to poor atomization. I'm pretty sure what happens is the fuel just remains liquid and wherever it sits, it slowly burns off and the carbon remains. The most effected parts are your injectors (fuel just wont flow) and rings (if it gets bad enough it can take out your cylinder walls)

Now this will happen with any diesel... but faster with WVO and WMO. I also believe this problem is exponential... so if you already have some deposits when you start running on WVO (as 99% of conversion do) more will appear faster and faster. When the fuel is heated it atomizes properly and it drastically cuts down on this problem. So one thing to do would be to heat the fuel before you start driving, just like plugging in a block heater. This still doesn't cut down the problem too much as your engine itself will be very cold.

most often with waste oils the question is how many miles can you get out of a truck before you kill it, especially with blending. Unfortunate, but true. Also if your truck is in pretty good shape when you start.. and you maintain it, that can mean getting a solid 100,000 (or more) out of blended fuels. Many more miles with proper waste oil conversions. If you blend 50/50 even at 10 MPG that's ~$40,000. But then some people get a really ****** truck, convert it, and kill it in 5k.

That's my opinion... I'd also say short trips are easily the most dangerous for waste oils... engine isn't hot enough, and not long enough purge times. But if you've got a good old truck, then perhaps you could do it for 2-3 years with no problems.

 

[AcIdBuRn02ZTS]

I'm blending w80... filtering and centrifuging.. then mixing 7 gallons to a full (26 gallon) tank of d2...

Short drives not a good idea. I always plug the truck in when its under 50... but still doesn't get warm enough for complete combustion on oil.

I'm going 2 tank for sure... already ordered the fuel cell... just wanted to see if I could blend any in my main tank just to cut down on d2... according to cummins, you can run 10% by volume.

The heat will definately help after its warmed up. I will run straight w80 in the fuel cell and it will be heated.. start, warm up, and shut down on d2
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[AcIdBuRn02ZTS]

Yup... gotta pull the injectors this weekend for sure... the smoke is unbearable at the moment. First thing Saturday morning... in the 15 degree cold.. I'll pop the injectors out and knock the carbon off the tips. I'm glad it only takes about 25 minutes to pull the injectors on this truck.

-Chris

 

[Josh Carmack]

JSVD I tend to disagree, I bought a truck with 380,000 on it, and now its at 420,000 a little over 30,000 was on almost a pure mix of WMO. At 380,000 it would suffice to say my engine was nearing it's end, but yet it really hasn't progressed much further down the line of being "killed" yet. With my worn injectors I find that it runs better and has more power on WMO. I assume thats due to the heavier fuel atomizing better in worn fuel components. Of course most of my trips are long ones. I live way way way out in BFE and may make three trips to town a day. One for one job, and back home for lunch, and another trip for my night job, on weekends i keep the roads hot. Until I read where lots of trucks are dropping dead within 10 to 15k miles after being run on WMO I won't believe it's as bad as people say it can be.

 

[AcIdBuRn02ZTS]

I say you are right. As long as the oil is clean and somewhat close to the viscosity of diesel before injection, whether it be from heat or blending, and the proper care is taken.... thee is no reason to shy away from it.

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[JSVD]

Your truck has more power running WMO because WMO has a higher BTU rating. More viscous fuel will not atomize better with worn fuel components. Fuel components also typically clog more than they wear.

I also believe that WMO does not deposit as much coking as WVO in cold weather, as it's still closer to the viscosity of diesel than WVO. Blending WMO will obviously prevent this further. I still can guarantee you that while your truck is running on WMO, you are doing more damage to it than while running on Diesel. Don't believe me? look at the colour of your exhaust. There's also not the problem of water in WMO as there is in WVO. There is the problem of heavy metals and other things which can wear your fuel system down... I don't know much about this as I'm on the WVO side of things. Long story short it's situational. Minor differences in blending or filtering can extend or shorten the life of your truck by 10-20k.

I still agree with you though... I think the damage done by waste oil fuels is way over-hyped. Sure if you pour waste grease into your truck you can kill it pretty fast. But my point above was if you use waste oils in an older vehicle with some caution, you can get the mileage out of the vehicle that will pay for your investment. That being said if you know nothing about a diesel, and start dumping in WMO/WVO.. you may get lucky... but you'll probably kill your truck in 10-15k

 

[AcIdBuRn02ZTS]

All 4 injectors had coking around the holes... quite a bit.

They had been cleaned and tested less then 500 miles ago.. and this was the first tank I had ran with any oil mixed in... 7 gallons of w80 to 19 gallons of d2... so again, short drives and wmo.. on a Cummins anyways... not a good idea.

I'll post up some pics later..

I do believe I'm going to give water/**** a try... but I wont be making any more short trips on any blends of waste oil.. Just isn't worth it. Ive heard quite a few people having good luck running water/**** or propane injection to combat coking... I found a kit from "Devil's Own" that is reasonably priced... $240 for the whole setup minus a tank... and since I will only be using it for cleaning and not a power adder or to decrease EGTs, I'm just going to tap into my washer fluid tank as it wont be getting used very often.

Anyways...
-Chris

 

[Brad S.]

Try changing your mix a little. Now that you know what the injectors look like.
Try a 75% wmo with a little more D2, or now its cold outside do D1.
Then take another look at the injectors say after 250 miles, if its not too hard to pull em, etc.

 

[FarmerFrank]

i agree with the water ****. i only have it for cleaning and i like to think it helps. After the engine is warm and im at a stop light or something i flip it on and it'll start putting steam out the pipe, then i hammer on it for half a mile or so while its on or while pulling a big hill and know those pistons are toasty hot. is this the right way? im not sure. has it blow a hole in a piston? not yet.have i ever had an injector coke up? not that i know of. i found straight water worked best but now i add washer fluid to keep it from freezing.
http://www.aquastealth.com/watermethanolinjectionkit.aspx
I used this kit with the 350-450 hp range because i origanally bought it for denotation in my bronco but never put it on

 

[AcIdBuRn02ZTS]

As for the water/****... its not suggested you use it at idle as it "could" hydro-lock the engine...

From my understanding, its best to engage via boost switch or WOT switch... Mine will be armed via a main switch and activated when boost rises above 15psi (which is basically anytime I'm not at idle)... and it will only be used on occasion as I don't think it will be needed too often once I get the 2nd tank installed and the fphe plumbed...

Here are a few shots of one of the cleaner injectors...

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This was the first one I pulled which was cleaner then the other 3... The other three had chunks of a brownish/yellowish ash on the injector tip. Keep in mind this is after driving for several days on straight d2 with a heavy dose of PS Diesel Klean.

Now, with all of that said... I certainly wont stay away from wmo all together. My 2nd fuel tank has arrived.. just need to get it mounted and plumbed. Once the fphe is plumbed in also, I don't think I'll have anymore coking issues, especially once I get the water **** system put on the truck... Which I plan to order it here in a few weeks.

Keep in mind, my issues arose after a week of short trip daily driving.. less then 1 mile to work. Yes the block heater was used but the engine doesn't reach operating temp on the drive. I think after this, I will stick to using wmo only on longer distance trips which will still save a lot of coin.

-Chris

 

[AcIdBuRn02ZTS]

Its up and running good again... zero haze/smoke and power is back to normal.

 

[FarmerFrank]

Its up and running good again... zero haze/smoke and power is back to normal.

Glad to hear

 

[FarmerFrank]

What did you end up selecting for your second tank and where did you mount it? Sounds like a neat little truck