Unknown starting issue. Problem almost certainly lies with operator.

[74IDI]

I’m brand new to IDI’s and this is the first forum post I’ve ever made.

I picked up a 1974 F-350 Dually from La Grande Oregon the other day. The guy said he got it as a parts truck a year ago when a distant family member passed. He told me it was supposed to be a running and driving truck but he never tried.

He told me it has a 6.9 swap. It had a non working starter in it that looked to be from an 83-84, but I swapped one in from an 85, and it cranks good. I grabbed an auxiliary boat fuel tank of diesel, a battery and some jumper cables for a test start.

Did an oil change and fuel filter change, put some fresh atf in the fuel filter and cranked it over for a bit with the fuel shutoff off without realizing. Put an alligator clip from the battery to the solenoid and heard it click.

Cracked open lines on the injection pump to see if fuel was coming through the injection pump, there was on both sides. Also tried to bleed the injectors and released pressure from the shraeder valve, potentially didn’t do it enough.

Not sure what to do to get it running from here, have cranked for about a minute with no discernibile difference. I’m not sure but I’d imagine theres lots of air in the lines so I’m thinking I may just need to keep cranking.

There is a return line at the end of a line coming from the injection pump that was hooked up to nothing, and spills fuel out when I stop cranking.

Not sure if I’m missing something obvious or if I’m on the right track. I’ve never seen one of these engines before this week so I’m just doing my best with forum searching.

I don’t believe I’ve left out anything else. I haven’t put any power to the glow plugs, which is something I was also suspecting might be an issue, but it’s been in the 80s-90s for the last week so I figured it would be okay.

Absolutely any help is appreciated, I’m at the end of my self-reliant knowledge.

Edit: I also forgot to mention that I can’t seem to see any fuel coming out of the lines to the injectors. That is the main problem. It feels like all my fuel is just going to the return line.

 

[IDIBOBS]

glow plugs?

 

[74IDI]

glow plugs?

How can I get power to them? Is it the relay looking thing on the firewall the solenoid for it?

 

[Jesus Freak]

Yeah, that's the glow plug controller on the back of the engine.

These engines need glow plugs even if it's 100F in the shade, or if your glow plugs are disabled, give it a puff of ether on the air filter.

Another thing that is better than spinning it with the starter is to have a buddy pull you while you pop the clutch in 3rd gear. For some reason these engines will crank up in -10F popping the clutch without glow plugs faster than they'll crank up in 110F with glow plugs, it's some type of miracle. Keep us posted!

 

[DirtyWood]

If you're not getting any fuel out of the injection lines it is possible the injection pump is seized. Maybe someone more knowledgeable than me can offer a way to verify whether or not an IP is seized, I dunno.

Glow plugs are an important part of the starting system but not 100% needed when the weather is hot and you have a solid starter, batteries, and a tight fuel system. Just for kicks I've decided to go all summer without using my glow plugs and we'll see if I kill my starter or not. Since June 1st the longest crank time I've had was 4 seconds until the engine started, low temps in the 50s.

 

[IDIBOBS]

How can I get power to them? Is it the relay looking thing on the firewall the solenoid for it?

Yes that’s it. If your going to own an old vehicle your going to have to get good at wiring and re wiring. It seams daunting but it’s pretty simple. Get a test light, multi meter, or a power probe. Look for wiring diagrams and start testing.

But with your update about no fuel that’s the first problem. You’re going to need to figure out if it’s the lift pump, filter, or injection pump. Diesel should not sit unused very much. Things get gummed up pretty easy.

 

[74IDI]

Yes that’s it. If your going to own an old vehicle your going to have to get good at wiring and re wiring. It seams daunting but it’s pretty simple. Get a test light, multi meter, or a power probe. Look for wiring diagrams and start testing.

But with your update about no fuel that’s the first problem. You’re going to need to figure out if it’s the lift pump, filter, or injection pump. Diesel should not sit unused very much. Things get gummed up pretty easy.

Yes luckily I have all the tools for getting wiring set up with me already, I cracked the lines coming out of the injection pump, the ones pictured in the last two photos, and fuel came out of them when I cranked. I’m not sure what pressure it should have been at by then, but it didn’t seem very high.

 

[74IDI]

Yeah, that's the glow plug controller on the back of the engine.

These engines need glow plugs even if it's 100F in the shade, or if your glow plugs are disabled, give it a puff of ether on the air filter.

Another thing that is better than spinning it with the starter is to have a buddy pull you while you pop the clutch in 3rd gear. For some reason these engines will crank up in -10F popping the clutch without glow plugs faster than they'll crank up in 110F with glow plugs, it's some type of miracle. Keep us posted!

Ah well it seems to have a C6 bolted to it so I’m not sure how much poppin the clutch’ll do for it . Strangely it does actually have one as it used to be a manual before the swap.

 

[DirtyWood]

If you crack the injection lines where they connect to the injectors you should get some wetness there but even with the engine running there won't be a tremendous spray with the line just barely cracked open--more like a dribble down and on to the plastic return line cap.

 

[Jesus Freak]

If you're not getting any fuel out of the injection lines it is possible the injection pump is seized. Maybe someone more knowledgeable than me can offer a way to verify whether or not an IP is seized, I dunno.

Glow plugs are an important part of the starting system but not 100% needed when the weather is hot and you have a solid starter, batteries, and a tight fuel system. Just for kicks I've decided to go all summer without using my glow plugs and we'll see if I kill my starter or not. Since June 1st the longest crank time I've had was 4 seconds until the engine started, low temps in the 50s.

I love it, keep us posted on your findings. I run on waste oil, so there's no way it would fire this side of hell without ether(and NW Florida is a similar zip code to hell FYI)....I gave up on glow plugs firing oil too.

 

[Jesus Freak]

Ah well it seems to have a C6 bolted to it so I’m not sure how much poppin the clutch’ll do for it . Strangely it does actually have one as it used to be a manual before the swap.

Ahhhhh, yet another problem with the C6 on our wonky engines...... even with an E4OD you can get it rolling, tap your brake, and wink at your neighbor just before you turn on your left turn signal, pull it into drive and yell "yeeeee....haaaaaa....." Causing the torque converter to lock up and crank your engine over......

P.S. that's a joke, so don't try it unless you have a comical YouTube channel and need content.....

 

[74IDI]

If you crack the injection lines where they connect to the injectors you should get some wetness there but even with the engine running there won't be a tremendous spray with the line just barely cracked open--more like a dribble down and on to the plastic return line cap.

Okay cool, because I’ve been trying with those lines cracked, that’s what I haven’t been seeing fuel come out of. I’ll work on it today and give it some more cranks.

 

[IDIBRONCO]

A few thoughts here:
First I want to say welcome and that's going to be a GREAT truck someday.
It can take a lot of cranking with the starter to bleed air out of the injector lines.
I noticed that you mentioned "battery". These engines take a lot of power to get running when they're cold. You really need two batteries if you only have one. You might not be able to spin the engine over fast enough to get it running with only one battery even after you get fuel to the injectors. You might try using a battery charger on the battery for some extra cranking power if you only have one battery.
The return line that goes to nothing is supposed to run to the fuel tank. I say "tank" because I only saw one tank in your pictures. You're getting fuel out of it when you stop cranking with the starter. You're also getting fuel out of the pump at the injector lines so you know that the pump is working in that regard. I feel like you should run a fuel line (5/16") from the fitting on the back of the metal return line into your fuel can to complete that part of the system.
I'll agree with IDIBOBS that you should address your lack of fuel issue before the glow plugs. Again, since you have fuel out of the pump and the return line, your fuel system is in good enough shape until the injector pump anyway. Have you loosened the injector lines nuts on top of the injectors while you crank over the engine? That does help get air out of the injector lines because it removes the pressure inside the lines. Air does not compress (build pressure) as well as a liquid (fuel) does. Once you can see fuel to most or all of your injectors, then you can tighten those nuts back up again and try to start the engine.
One last thing, don't try to plug off the return line at the back of the engine. The injector pumps need a constant flow of fuel to cool them off. Also if you get too much pressure in your return lines, the pump will stop pumping fuel.

 

[onetonjohn]

Don't know if you have one, but a starting switch to bypass the solenoid is pretty helpful for bleeding the system you can buy one or make your own Pretty handy. Have you spun off the fuel filter and check if you have fuel? Agree with idi bronco to get the fuel line spilling fuel to return to tank or can. One thing I found helpful was while cranking to push in shredder valve by the filter and let air/fuel come out till it's just fuel.

 

[IDIBRONCO]

One thing I found helpful was while cranking to push in shredder valve by the filter and let air/fuel come out till it's just fuel.

No need. There's already fuel coming out of the pump.