Smoke after turbo install

BlindAmbition

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I'm getting quite a bit of smoke after installing a turbo. I had the truck running well before the turbo, now it smokes at idle and even worse at throttle. Smoke makes my eyes water, seems to be fuel related. I have these following questions:

Do I need to turn the fuel up to get a more complete burn?
Is timing affected by the addition of a turbo?
What timing should I shoot for? 8*, 9.5*? Is that at idle or at 2000 rpm?
 

BlindAmbition

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I should add it has zero problems starting, fires immediately after 10 seconds of glow plugs, doesn't need them after the first start.
 

IDIBRONCO

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You don't turn the fuel up to get a more complete burn. You only have an incomplete burn when you have more fuel than you have air to burn it. Did you turn up the fuel when you installed the turbo? If so, how much? What color is the smoke? Unless you moved the IP, your timing won't be affected by installing a turbo. 8* at 2000 RPM is the "standard" starting point for timing. I've seen several people say that their liked less than 8* timing with a turbo. If you can, check your timing to see where it's at. Then go from there. Another thing to check is if there is something that's blocking off your air flow to the turbo. This is just a example: if you bought your turbo kit used, maybe someone stuck a rag inside the air cleaner to try to keep dirt out. Maybe that rag got sucked onto your air filter and is blocking some or most of the air filter.
 

BlindAmbition

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I have not turned up the fuel. The idea to turn it up comes from several posts I've read saying that if the fuel is too low then the mixture doesn't ignite properly. Currently there isn't an air filter on it while I diagnose this, shouldn't be any obstruction. I have advanced it some more and it seems to burn cleaner, I cannot seem to physically get it to move any further, even with loosening lines. The square knob to stick a wrench on it has stripped so I cannot move it that way, only with a pry bar.
 

IDIBRONCO

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It seems like you're on to something with your timing advance. The fuel will still burn the same way whether you have just barely enough air to burn what's in your cylinder or you have enough air the burn 5 gallons of fuel at once. It will make a difference if the fuel is injected too late or if the fuel isn't being atomized properly. Those have to do with your IP timing and injectors.
 

IDIBRONCO

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The pump rebuilders say to set it the same as a 7.3. Same RPM, same timing specs (8* as a starting point). I can't remember where the 1400 RPM came from. It seems like it was from a different type of timing device that's seldom used these days. Maybe the luminosity probe that screwed the probe into the glow plug hole in #1 cylinder?
 

Big Bart

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I think 1,400rpm was for the Rotuda timing unit as I recall.

Maybe different for a turbo. Most who have a NA suggest they like 9.5* @ 2,000rpm, mine is at 8.5* and happy with that. And yes the same for both 6.9’s and 7.3’s.

Perhaps when they made (New) or rebuilt the turbo the shaft seals did not go in correctly and they are leaking oil into the intake or exhaust. Thus causing smoke.

Is the turbo spinning at idle? Perhaps the bearings are tight and the turbo is not spinning. When my housing on my boat turbo rusts from sitting for 3-6 months it interferes with the exhaust fan on the turbo and keeps it from spinning. I gun it and my engine bogs and I get a ton of black smoke out the exhaust. Then I have to take a ratchet to the fan nut on the intake side and clear the rust. I am guessing that is not doing my fan any favors. Remove the intake, you should be able to spin the turbo with your fingers. It may not keep spinning but it should not be hard to spin it.

But I cannot think of a reason why swapping out a turbo would introduce issues unless it has tight/bad bearings and restricts the air flow or bad seals and is dropping oil into the intake and burning it. Or dumping oil into the exhaust where it is cooking it.
 

BlindAmbition

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I'll be back at it today trying to time this engine. It keeps reading -20 on my meter, I cannot for the life of me get it to read correctly with the magnetic pickup. Ordered a timing light and will use a combo of the 3300-S meter I have along with the light to get a reading. Turbo moves freely, no issues there.
 

Big Bart

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I'll be back at it today trying to time this engine. It keeps reading -20 on my meter, I cannot for the life of me get it to read correctly with the magnetic pickup. Ordered a timing light and will use a combo of the 3300-S meter I have along with the light to get a reading. Turbo moves freely, no issues there.
If you use the magnetic pick up, in the tab over the damper, -20* offset on cyl 1 is correct. J-3300-S will pick - 20* when you choose magnetic probe. That hole for the magnetic probe is not at TDC, it is 20* off TDC, thus the -20*. So you actually have it right.

If you use the light you want 0*. Then set your timing light advance to 8.5, 9, or 9.5 degrees (To your liking.) and set timing to have your timing mark at TDC on the damper. (Because the timing tab on the chain cover only has a mark for TDC.)

Just a reminder for the broader membership for Tach n Time or Tech Time, it’s -20*, with magnetic probe in the tab over damper, cylinder 1 (Front passenger cylinder), 8.5-9.5* BTDC, and at 2000 rpm.
 

IDIBRONCO

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With the timing light on the Tach and Time units, you hold the 2000 RPM and use the two buttons to "move" the line on the balancer. When it lines up with the mark on the timing tab, you read the degree setting. It works a little bit differently than the one that Bart described. Just a hint. I always try to highlight the mark on the tab to make it more visible. I like to use a white out pen for this.
 

Big Bart

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IDIBronco, are you referring to the Kent Moore factory timing light or a 3rd party one? Perhaps we skinned the same cat two different ways. I always read on this site you need a timing light with timing advance when using the pick up bar on these. (Figured those who said so, knew so.) So wondering why folks say you have to have that feature in the light, if the Kent Moore will do the same thing. I never tried to do the offset with the Kent Moore box when I had a timing light hooked to it, easier to use the buttons on the timing light, but it makes sense the offset on the Kent Moore box would advance the timing too.

My magnetic pick up did not work, but I did not spend much time playing with it. (Still not sure if I just needed to clean the damper.) So just moved on to my Snap On timing light which has timing advance. For me it is still easier to have one hand on the throttle and one on the timing light. I can hold the light and do advance with one hand. But if I had a helper I guess I could use one hand on the Kent Moore and the other to hold the timing light while my helper kept the engine at 2,000 rpms.

But would like to get a working magnetic pick up for the future. Then I have a free hand!
 

IDIBRONCO

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I was referring to this type of meter right here. Using this style of meter with a timing light, you hold the RPM at 2000, use the light to see the two marks on the balancer and the tab. Then you use the buttons which I forgot to mention are also on the DTI timing light. As you push one or the other button, the mark on the balancer will appear to move. You line the two marks up and then read the degrees of advance in the meter screen. You can also buy a small turnbuckle to attach between the throttle on the IP (where the cable attaches) and the fast idle solenoid mounting bracket. Then adjust the turnbuckle until your engine is running at 2000 RPM. Then you don't have to try holding the RPM by hand. I thought about a different timing light, but I wanted the exact same set up that we used at the shop where I worked on these engines so I bent over and bought the DTI light too. That way. I know for a fact that everything will work.
 

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Big Bart

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IDIBronco that is a Tech Time, as you probably know the Tach n Time J33300 is by Kent Moore. But they are very similar. Next time I have my Kent Moore out I will try the same trick. Likely the Tach n Time works the same way.

Question, the factory timing light for the Tech Time, does it have buttons on the back for timing advance?

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