R&D vs Type4 cam?

Discussion in '6.9L IH & 7.3L IDI Diesels' started by dunk, Jan 2, 2016.

  1. dunk

    dunk Dunce

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    What are the differences in these cams? Any other cams available for the IDI? I've never built turbo motors or diesels before so not sure what exactly we're looking for in a turbo cam for a diesel. Currently running a 6.9 with Banks non wastegate, going to a hotter pump and likely changing to a different/better turbo at some point this year.

    R&D:
    Intake Duration: 178*@.050"
    Exhaust Duration 190*@.050"
    Lobe Sep: 108*
    Lift: Int .410"/ Exh .412"

    Type4:
    What are specs on this? As best I can tell lift is .392"/.380", correct?
    What is duration at .050"?

    What is stock cam specs? Wishing I had degreed the cam in a parts motor I had a while back. What are we looking for in a cam for a turbo IDI?

    How about lifters? I'd be comfortable replacing them on a 100k+ mile engine when changing the cam. What is available and what is good quality?

    Anyone have experience with either cam or both? What are your engine specs? What changes in power, towing, torque, MPG did you notice?
     
  2. IDIoit

    IDIoit MachinistFabricator Supporting Member

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    i have Russ's cam,
    i asked about the specs, but he was real hush hush about it..lol
    i have not ran it yet. hoping to get this project done soon.

    heres a "stock turbo cam" sold by grumpys.

    I E
    .050" Duration 176 184
    Cam Lift .253" .253"

    http://www.ebay.com/itm/1994-IHC-Na...ash=item3f2a402f50:g:eysAAOxyL7hSUGag&vxp=mtr

    83-94 N/A?

    Cam Lift -- Int."/Exh."

    .253/.253
    .050" Duration -- Int./Exh.

    176/184
    Lobe Seperation Angle

    103/105

    http://www.ebay.com/itm/88-94-Ford-...ash=item19d2cb62c3:g:bWgAAOSw-W5UrUvd&vxp=mtr
     
  3. Clb

    Clb Another old truck Supporting Member

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    Somewhere here there is a comparo of them. Been a year or so.
    Iirc
    Rus is for pulling
     
    Last edited: Jan 2, 2016
  4. racer30

    racer30 Full Access Member

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    There are some threads that have the specs laid out.. you will need to do some digging to find them... I was around when the ground work was being done on the J2 cam way back in late 2012. I was looking to have a custom Grind done and was having difficulty finding a Guy that would do what I wanted done.. I had a profile all worked up on a simulator that was a huge step up in performance on the sim...
    The problem was nobody local would grind up lobes for me on just my research. so I had to settle for a profile from the grinders catalog of lobes he had for his machine.. This was not what I wanted and it was a bitter pill to swallow after spending all the time on the sim working up the grind... I ran into a Fella who was also wanting a more aggressive Turbo specific profile and we talked about what we were trying to accomplish and he went and had a grind done. I got one of the first few cams done and his specs where not exactly what I was looking for but was closer than the typ4 cam that was already out and had some good results on both NA and Turbo Engines.
    I got a chance to ride in the First Truck the J2 was installed in.. It had just pulled a 342RWHP (aprox 430 Crank HP) run on the rollers and he did a 40' Two Gear Burn out that was all I needed to see to tell me I was doing the right thing.. A lot has happened since then and R&D has two cams out now with a slightly different profile than the J2.. I have No doubt R&D has good stuff.. I have met the owner and he is a great guy with amazing skills and has pushed the limits of the IDI right to the edge. You can run any of his products on your Engine and you will be Impressed with the results. My Next Engine for my truck project will have more than a few of his products for sure.. Do some digging you will find a lot of info on how to increase performance from your IDI...
     
  5. typ4

    typ4 Supporting Member Supporting Member

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    My cam is known for great low end torque. I don't even have the specs as it is a proprietary grind the shop developed. It makes 218/461 in my truck and I haven't fine tuned it yet.
    Be realistic about what you use your truck for,because just going for max HP may make towing a nightmare.
     
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  6. crash-harris

    crash-harris Breaker! Breaker!

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    How much is your cam Russ? Holding onto the hopes of a IDIT 7.3L build for Bruiser. I like low end torque :D Usually the only number I pay much attention to, other than the dollar signs.
     
  7. typ4

    typ4 Supporting Member Supporting Member

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    Pm me
     
  8. riotwarrior

    riotwarrior Supporting Member Supporting Member

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    Cam cards....

    All I wanna see are the cards

    Dunna matter what folks say...I like knowing WTF I am about jam into my engine and where it should and how it should perform.

    Crane comp and all the other bjg cam companiez offer cards...

    Just sayin...
     
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  9. Clb

    Clb Another old truck Supporting Member

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    Was there a set of dyno pulls run, using them both at one of the ralleys some time back?
     
  10. 88 Ford

    88 Ford Full Access Member

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    Russ dynoed his when Justin Anderson dynoed his with a J2 cam. That is the only time I've ever known of where they were both dynoed.
     
  11. typ4

    typ4 Supporting Member Supporting Member

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    Keep in mind my dyno numbers are with a stock pump turned up with the fuel screw. Next dyno will be with a moose, then one of r&d ,s to see what a modded 093 can support.
     
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  12. dunk

    dunk Dunce

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    Found a comparison from a while back. The R&D IDI Performance "Stage 1" cam with specs in my original post has no mention of being either the same or different than a "J2" cam, so no idea if this dyno comparison is the same cam or not. I assume the typ4 cam is the same mystery grind. No extensive details on the engines or trucks used so not sure if there were any differences in turbo, pump, driveline, etc. that may have affected the numbers but I'd imagine the general curve and peaks should be fairly representative.

    http://www.powerstrokenation.com/forums/20-6-9-7-3l-idi-diesels-83-93-model-years/120526-typ4-j2-cam-comparison.html

    Cams.jpg

    It seems the typ4 cam may be better for my goals, lots of torque off idle and lower RPM cruising. Both would be at about the same torque at my target highway cruise (2000 RPM). Though slower speeds around 600 RPM there is a 100 ft/lbs difference that I feel would be noticeable. I'm used to mountains of torque off idle and that is what I want from my IDI.

    I hate buying mystery products, every cam manufacturer publishes cam specs. This is not some top secret racing event, this is a one off regrind for what most people consider to be old junk that clearly does not have a significant enough following for any of the big boys to be interested in offering cams.

    Been there done that, by accident. On first build of my 460 I went with a Lunati 61602 which is a 262/268 on a 112 LSA with .540/.552 lift. Was sold on the aggressive ramp rates and more area under the curve, more lift in a smaller cam, etc. and thought the wide LSA would keep it mellow. Well it was a great cam, but not for a tow pig. Came on around 3000 RPM like an on/off switch and pulled hard to well over 6000. Under 3000 is was a little mushy. A blast to drive around unloaded but not fun towing.

    Swapped for a Comp 34-235-4 which is 262/270 on 111 LSA and .514/.524 lift. With this cam it has mountains of torque off idle and runs out of breathe early though will pull to 5500 if pressed. I normally shift around 2000-2200. It's fun to wind out from time to time but with that cam there is no more 6500 RPM shifts lighting up 35" tires on the 2-3 and 3-4 shifts like with the Lunati. Shame, but the torque at any RPM is heavenly when towing grades, very forgiving.
     
  13. Clb

    Clb Another old truck Supporting Member

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    I would like to see the same truck, eng, dyno, time of year,and ambient temp and humidity, and 3pulls each on the cams in question so as to get a real comparo.
    A tweeked eng. with a 5 gear vs a bone stocked with an auto are not compareable.
    Back to your regular programming.
     
  14. FORDF250HDXLT

    FORDF250HDXLT The life of an Indian is like the wings of the air Supporting Member

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    what? you mean you can't just dump a clutch in high gear,let it bellow enough smoke that would block out a 4 lane hwy on a dyno,in a feeble attempt to try and trick kids into thinking the truck has good take off power by calling it "towing power"? :D

    get your cam from Russ.his grind will hand all others their ass and you wont be feeding the trolls.as to the other cam mentioned here........not worth my time to comment on.
     
  15. Clb

    Clb Another old truck Supporting Member

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    ^^^
    Grunt!
    Period.
    The " millions of horsepower" claims are useless.
     

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