F-650 with Cummins upgrade??

Billysgoat

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Anybody out there played with a Cummins in an F-650??? The one we have at work could sure use a touch more pep. Right now it's pretty much sway and pray getting on the interstate (sway over, run someone out of the lane you need and pray they don't get tag or DOT #'s)
 

Pacific

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Not much you can do about it the 5.9 Cummins is way too small for a medium duty its only one step above a gas powered medium duty.

What transmission does this truck have etc ?

It always makes me laugh when people b*tch about medium duties powered by the 5.9B being underpowered. Who ever spec'ed the truck should have their nuts run through the ringer.

You are just gonna have to drive the truck harder and start building speed up couple miles before you have to merge into traffic. You can't safely increase the power the 5.9 or you will end up with a melt down. You just have to face the fact the 5.9 isn't designed for a medium duty application.

Like I said merging into traffic safely can be done you just have to work at it by using momentum and timing. Don't worry about running the engine to the peg if you need to-do it do it.

There are alot of underpowered trucks out there hell there are 35,000lb gvw medium duties plying the roads with ISB power :eek:

Good luck
 

Deezle1

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u can do plenty to the 5.9, u just gotta know how to go about it. if u open up the exhaust and get a free flowing air element to keep the egts in check and bump up the boost (play with the waste gate if its wastegated),do injectors for fuel, time the fuel pump...i dont know how much that version of the 5.9 differs from others, so i cant say much till u give us some more details.

I know the 5.9 is a small engine, but if you know how to tune it properly u can make it kick some serious hind end. with that said its like any other diesel, u just gotta know how to wake it up!

Best wishes,
Dom
 

Pacific

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The exhaust is probably already maxed out most medium duties run a pretty open free flowing exhaust. You start turning the fuel up too much then the EGTs get too high definatly need a pyro and keep your foot out of it.

If the hp rating now is at 230hp shes maxed out another thing to find out is the engine governed down to keep people from speeding ?

If the engine isn't able to rev to 3000rpm then shes been governed back.

The other question is this your truck or a company truck ?

If its a company truck ie doesn't belong to you then I would leave well enough alone and tell your boss you feel unsafe driving the POS. If you really feel the truck is way to slow to be driving on the road tell your boss that he needs to replace the truck with something better. You are the driver you can refuse to drive if your really concerned.

Now if this is your own truck and you bought the truck with 5.9 power you dug your own grave you shouldn't have bought the truck with low power. I would really consider getting rid of the truck and get something better or spend the money and repower the truck with ISC power a engine better meant for medium duty.

I imagine the truck has a under CDL gvw which in this area is a light duty medium duty (3 ton) probably only good for max 4.5 ton payload. Like I said I know a few trucks with 30-33,000lb gvws with B power those trucks are extremely underpowered they climb hills in first gear.
 

Duke

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Okay, let's not turn this into a 5.9L bashing session!!

While the 5.9L is at its' limits in a M/D application, if it's in an F-650, that means it's probably at 26,000 or under. That's do-able for a 5.9L, but you won't get there in a hurry. LOL

While the 5.9L junkies out there would disagree with Pacific, it probably is unwise to turn up the fuel in a 5.9 in a M/D truck without a well-installed pyro and watching the pyro gauge like a hawk when hill climbing with a load.

A 5.9L in a D/C pickup is running at 10-25% of it's operating capacity for the average diesel pickup enthusiast, so it does a great job in that application. Anyone who owns a M/D truck and loads it up with weight knows a 5.9L would be pedal to the metal 90% of the time, so turning up the fuel would result in very high EGT's and a precarious situation on those heavily loaded situations.

I think a mild pump turn-up would be OK, but you must get a pyro gauge and watch it when it's under load. Shortened engine life would also be a factor compared to a 5.9L at stock settings.
 

Pacific

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No one knows what power rating the engine is at now the original poster hasn't replied back. If its down in the 190hp range he can crank it up but it shes already turned up then gotta get used to the 4 banger rice cookers passing you LOL

I noticed the guy lives in Florida so he can't be pulling any steep hills so there must be another problem with the truck if it can't run safely on the freeway. Like I have meantioned look at the old gas pot medium duty trucks they are slow and gutless but they don't make the nightly news that they caused a accident for being too slow.

You look at some of those old tandem axle dump truck and cement mixers with 6/71 power (195hp) they are balls to the walls and still go slow.
 

Duke

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Maybe his everyday driver is a fast vehicle and he's not used to a M/D's "performance" or lack thereof.
 

Billysgoat

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Okay, I obviously got a coupla things to get cleared up.

Truck info, it is an 03 F-650 with a 5.9 and Allison Auto, it is under 26k GVWR and it normally runs at around 18-20K. I DID NOT have a thing to do with buying the POS. The idiots who did deserve to be shot for committing a travesty (they had the frame cut WAY down it has a 12 ft bed on it). Having said that, the truck has enough power to pull hills and maintain speed just fine. It has enough power to make it to Interstate speeds fairly well. I know a bit about loaded trucks, used to run Mack R's grossing at 80-100K, now that is SLOW!

Here's the deal, my truck has the same engine, fairly modified, when I am hooked to my camper I cross the scales at 23K. I have 0 problems pulling, passing, merging or outrunning with it. I know the engine is capable of enough power to make the F-650 it's in run like a scalded ass ape IF I WANT IT TO.

All I am looking for is a bit more HP to help in acceleration, with it being a 24V that means a box, but since the engine is not a "stand-alone" unit that means something that will work with the Ford puter. Is there such a unit out there??? I don't know, that's why I'm asking.

As for the bashing of the engine, having driven trucks that are of similar weight I am very glad this truck does have the 5.9, the 7.3 does not have the grunt of the 5.9 and the Cat is way to costly to upgrade, albeit it is a stronger motor "out of the box".

Ideal for me would be a "plug and play" box similar to the Edge EZ, not a lot of fuel or air added, but just enought to make a nice difference.

Thanks,

Billy
 

Pacific

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I found your problem in the first sentence its the Allison automatic that is what is causing your sluggishness it doesn't matter how much you want to boost your power its not going to help. I know Duke doesn't have much good to say about Juicers in medium duty trucks.
 

Billysgoat

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Double thanks nevrenuf, you have answered this on two different sites ;Sweet

As for the auto being the problem, if it is I'll take it, you try Miami with a stickshift during a rainstorm or rush hour. Or for that matter just drive I-4, you will be -cuss that gearshift quite quickly.
 

Duke

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Pacific,
It depends on the Allison. Some have 5 speeds with better lock-up.

On the 5.9L,


The difference between your 23K camper truck with a modified 5.9 and an M/D grossing 20-26K is that your pick-up isn't always towing a camper, whereas the 20-26K M/D is almost always 20K+ in weight. What about all the times when your pick-up is unloaded? That's a truck that weighs ~7K. pretty light work for a 5.9L. Will the F-650 ever get to weigh 7K? No way, you yourself said 18-20K unloaded. So now we've got 2 trucks: one weighs 7K 80% of the time, and the other weighs 18-26K 100% of the time.
Big difference.

Plus the fact that it only takes one trip into 1600 degree-ville with mods done to the F-650 and your M/D's 5.9L (or any diesel for that matter) might destroy itself.

We don't doubt for a second that you can turn up a 5.9L in an F-650 to 600HP if you want, but the engines life will be severely shortened. Put some retard cowboy behind the wheel and that diesel could be destroyed in one quick trip around town.

Most guys (myself included) want enough power to get the job done in decent time and an engine that lasts 300-400K. After all, I gotta pay for it if it breaks. ;)

Nobody's rippin your 5.9L, so don't think that's what's going to happen here. It's a legendary pick-up diesel. M/D's are a whole 'nother story.
 
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Pacific

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I know a juicer is nice for the heavy stop and go but it sure sucks up the power and there is very little left to turn the wheels. You have to make sure you stay within the transmissions power ratings too you never know maybe who ever spec'ed the truck chose the lightest ratings.
 
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