E4od help (long read)

[Jake9473]

Hello all, I am new to the forum.

First off, I have a 1994.5 f250 7.3 powerstroke. I bout the truck last August with it needed a Trans.

The Trans was rebuilt, but had no manual 1st gear, and when placed in drive started out in 3 rd gear. Will not shift on its own. That guy wouldn't warrantee the work because he said it was electrical. I fixed a wire off the solenoid pack plug that was chaffed, I also put a new shifter and od off switch on it because the wires were ripped out. Still same issue. I undid all the wires in the loom from the transmission to the relay on the drivers inner fender and cleaned contacts. Also replaced
Both relays.

I then took it to another transmission shop on September of last year, and he told me the transmission needed to be rebuilt, because the other shop butchered it. So I paid the piper and had them "rebuild" it. After having my truck for 3 and 1/2 weeks he called me and told me that the ECM was bad and that it needed a new one and needed to be flashed. So they did that and called me the following day and said that it still was still not shifting on its own, but I had manual first gear, and that I needed to come pick it up because he didn't have the room in his lot to store it but told me it had all the gears on the selector and to manually shift it until he could get it back in the shop in a week or two. When I came to pick up the truck, I noticed that when you place the selector In first gear take off and need to shift there is no difference between 1-2 on the dash. You can definitely feel the 2-3 shift but those are the only two gears. That was October 2014. Fast forward to 2 weeks ago. After calling every week since October finally got the truck in and he said he would get right on it. Low and behold the truck hasn't moved since I took it there and he dropped the pan and checked the valve body and valve body gasket as well as the accumulator body to make sure all the wormholes were the same. IN THE SNOW.

He called me yesterday and told me that the solenoid pack wasn't getting power to one wire and that they were going to bypass it with a "jumper". I called today and he told me that was done, but the solenoid pack still is not getting power.
I talked to the previous owner and he informed me that he only had 2nd and third gear and he quit driving it after it quit moving ( welded the forward clutches together from over heating with a Trans line leak)


WHAT GIVES?


I have speedometer and tachometer and they read true and I have exhausted my patience and my wallet.
And. No other forum has been able to help me whatsoever.

 

[direwulf23]

It's a long shot but I'd check the TCM fuse. Is the O/D light always on but dim? Certainly worth a check.
Are there any codes?
Also, you should definitely check this article out, a must read for any E4OD owner.

http://www.oilburners.net/forums/showthread.php?t=68423
E40D: The Importance Of A Clean Trans Harness. Code 62 & More

 

[trackspeeder]

94.5 would be an IDI. 94.5 PSD's were manual only.

Check the fuse and TCM relay first. If they are good, check the solenoid pack harness for damage.

 

[OLDBULL8]

94.5 would be an IDI. 94.5 PSD's were manual only.

Check the fuse and TCM relay first. If they are good, check the solenoid pack harness for damage.

He says he has a 94.5 with a E4OD. Like trackspeeder says 94.5 came with only manual. Looks like someone might have switched to auto. If that's the case, Lord only knows what could be wrong. The PO must have driven it after the change over with it screwed up to begin with. It would be a SWAG to what he has.

When I came to pick up the truck, I noticed that when you place the selector In first gear take off and need to shift there is no difference between 1-2 on the dash.

What do you mean by "on the dash"? That the selector pointer is between the 1 and 2 ?

Can you take a pic of the engine, that would definitely tell us if it's a PSD or IDI.

 

[Jake9473]

It's a long shot but I'd check the TCM fuse. Is the O/D light always on but dim? Certainly worth a check

I cant see it in the day, but at night yes the light is always on and dim

 

[Jake9473]

94.5 would be an IDI. 94.5 PSD's were manual only.

Check the fuse and TCM relay first. If they are good, check the solenoid pack harness for damage.

This truck build date is 10/94


I don't know where the fuse is located but I've changed most of them besides maxi fuses and all the relays are new. The plug going into the senoid pack is brand new, and the solenoid pack isteldf is brand new the Trans shop says 1 wire is not getting power to make it shift on its own

 

[Jake9473]

[QUOTE/]


What do you mean by "on the dash"? That the selector pointer is between the 1 and 2 ?

Can you take a pic of the engine, that would definitely tell us if it's a PSD or IDI.[/QUOTE]

This is definitely not an idi. The injectors are located under the valve covers.

And what I mean is if you manually place it in 1st gear on the dash, and take off, when you shift to second gear at the appropriate rpm, nothing happens. But 2-3 you can feel it shift.

The truck only has 2-3 and when put in drive starts in 3rd. The over drive off light is always on but very dim and can only be seen at night.

The transmission shop says that one wire going to the solenoid pack does not have power. Even jumping the wire from farther up the harness. The shop currently Has my truck but I am running out of patience thank all of you for your responses.

 

[tbrumm]

So, since the engine is a Powerstroke, and the build date is 10/94 (which means only a manual trans was available with a Powerstroke from Ford), a previous owner had the truck converted from manual to automatic. I wonder why - was the previous owner handicapped in some way that required that he have an auto? I begin to understand perhaps why two trans shops have not been able to make this thing work. I would still think they "should" be able to make this work, after all, they seem to know why it won't - one wire to the solenoid pack is not getting power, but beyond that, they can't seem to figure out how to get power to that wire at the right time. That leads me to think about the computers for both the engine and trans. I wonder how many computers are "on board". The reason I think about that is if the truck was originally had a a manual trans, maybe there was no program in the computer for running an E4OD. OP, You mentioned the shop "reflashed" the computer - I wonder if that was their attempt to get the auto trans programming into the Powerstroke computer. I also wonder when exactly this manual to auto conversion was done. Is is possible an IDI E4OD was mated up to the Powerstroke? In which case, the trans would have its own computer not connected with the engine computer and who knows how they connected up the VSS, tach sensor, etc to feed to the trans computer. I am just thinking out loud here-there is way more to this than a bad trans becauase if was just a bad trans, the two trans shop would have had this going long ago since a rebuild and new parts would have solved the problem. I wonder if a stand alone (US Shift or Baumann) trans controller would get this thing working.

 

[Jake9473]

So, since the engine is a Powerstroke, and the build date is 10/94 (which means only a manual trans was available with a Powerstroke from Ford), a previous owner had the truck converted from manual to automatic. I wonder why - was the previous owner handicapped in some way that required that he have an auto? I begin to understand perhaps why two trans shops have not been able to make this thing work. I would still think they "should" be able to make this work, after all, they seem to know why it won't - one wire to the solenoid pack is not getting power, but beyond that, they can't seem to figure out how to get power to that wire at the right time. That leads me to think about the computers for both the engine and trans. I wonder how many computers are "on board". The reason I think about that is if the truck was originally had a a manual trans, maybe there was no program in the computer for running an E4OD. OP, You mentioned the shop "reflashed" the computer - I wonder if that was their attempt to get the auto trans programming into the Powerstroke computer. I also wonder when exactly this manual to auto conversion was done. Is is possible an IDI E4OD was mated up to the Powerstroke? In which case, the trans would have its own computer not connected with the engine computer and who knows how they connected up the VSS, tach sensor, etc to feed to the trans computer. I am just thinking out loud here-there is way more to this than a bad trans becauase if was just a bad trans, the two trans shop would have had this going long ago since a rebuild and new parts would have solved the problem. I wonder if a stand alone (US Shift or Baumann) trans controller would get this thing working.

Not only was it red lashed but the shop put a different ecm in the truck. And then reflashed it. As far as it being a manual, I don't know. The previous owner was not the original and bought it the way it was. Also it has a rubber floor and I didn't ever see a hole in the floor where a manual would have been.

At this point I have 1300 in the first rebuild. 1500 in the second rebuild and 1000 for the truck itself. I can imagine that one of these external shifters is inexpensive and I am about at my wits end putting money into this truck. I still am not sure what you mean by other computers. As far as I know the only computers this truck has
That I could find is the ecm and idm

Thanks again for your input

 

[tbrumm]

The IDI does not require a computer to control the engine, but when an E4OD is bolted to the IDI, the E4OD does require a computer to control it. Without knowing how this possible trans conversion was done, I was just speculating that perhaps a used IDI E4OD was installed with its own computer separate from the ECM and IDM. If this was, indeed, a trans conversion, you just never know how cobbled up they will be.

You are also right in that a US Shift stand alone trans controller is not cheap either and neither is the harness that you have to buy to go with it.

When you purchase a truck, you don't normally consider weird crap like this. You can understand that a trans may be bad because it is wore out and needs a rebuild, but this - yikes!

 

[Jake9473]

The IDI does not require a computer to control the engine, but when an E4OD is bolted to the IDI, the E4OD does require a computer to control it. Without knowing how this possible trans conversion was done, I was just speculating that perhaps a used IDI E4OD was installed with its own computer separate from the ECM and IDM. If this was, indeed, a trans conversion, you just never know how cobbled up they will be.

You are also right in that a US Shift stand alone trans controller is not cheap either and neither is the harness that you have to buy to go with it.

When you purchase a truck, you don't normally consider weird crap like this. You can understand that a trans may be bad because it is wore out and needs a rebuild, but this - yikes!

Well, I do not know if the transmission is for an idi, but if it is there is no external control computer, I know this because I removed
The transmission the first rebuild. The baughman us shift controller is not as bad as I thought, and I am seriously considering this as an option. A fellow tech works at ford and printed out a symptoms chart for the automatic transmission using my vin number. It said with no manual first gear or over drive the wrong parts are the cause:

The first guy that built my transmission used an accumulator body out of a 4r100. I thought this was the issue all along, but the second shop said it was due to the lack of power to the shift solenoid. The other issue is when I asked the shop that has my truck now if they used parts according to the number on the transmission itself he said no the parts "for a 95" are all the same. So I really am at a loss but maybe the U.S. shift is the answer. I am still not 100% sure how it works if anyone can elaborate in laments terms that would be great

 

[trackspeeder]

A build date of 10-94, makes this a 95 model year. So a PSD E4OD was available.

Most parts for a 95 are the same. Depends on the application. Before you go the aftermarket controller route. You need to find out why tranny wont shift.

Things to check.

Check the solenoid pack.
Check the accumulator body, specially the D2 valve. Make sure its not hung up. A little hint. If the accumulator body bolts are over tighten the D2 valve will hang up. this will force a higher (third gear) start.
Check the line pressure. low line pressure will make the tranny go funky.

 

[Jake9473]

A build date of 10-94, makes this a 95 model year. So a PSD E4OD was available.

Most parts for a 95 are the same. Depends on the application. Before you go the aftermarket controller route. You need to find out why tranny wont shift.

Things to check.

Check the solenoid pack.
Check the accumulator body, specially the D2 valve. Make sure its not hung up. A little hint. If the accumulator body bolts are over tighten the D2 valve will hang up. this will force a higher (third gear) start.
Check the line pressure. low line pressure will make the tranny go funky.

Thanks for the info, the Trans shop has my truck and is "trying to finds why the wire isn't producing power."

I an between a rock and a hard place because they already got paid. And they only work on my truck when it's convenient for them.

 

[OLDBULL8]

Hey Jake, ya still going to Purdue? You need to invest in a ATSG manual for the E4OD, there about $30. Latest manual should have all the updates in it. I would bet the second rebuilder did nothing internally in it. It might have a generic pc, it would be behind the drivers side kick panel. Don't know if that has anything to do with the trans. tho, trackspeeder would know I think. They are expensive $450 for new, ebay has rebuilt, but they have to be programmed, dealer here charges $100 to do it.

Edit: Check and see if there is connectors on the drivers side, there kinda near the firewall hanging down inside, my 99 has three. the larger one comes from the trans, then there is two smaller ones.

Edit2: Just checked your 1st post, I see your new, so you ain't the JAKE I thought you are.

 

[e4od.com]

Determining E4OD mismatch

Hi Jake, Hope I can help - not an expert but, I do know a lot about the E4OD and its functionality. Normally, the 1st step is to pull codes on the Transmission from the OBD-I computer but, you may want to wait on that because you don't know if this was a custom swap and there may be a mismatch with the accumulator valve body.

In your comments above you mentioned, "The first guy that built my transmission used an accumulator body out of a 4r100 and this is a problem if you have a 1995 case. The 4R100 accumulator is only suppose to be used on 96 & Up cases for the E4OD. 1995 (F5) case can use a 90-95 accumulator valve body and the 1989 case had its own version of accumulator valve body. However, if you do have a F6 (1996) or F8 (1998) E4OD case then the 4R100 Accumulator valve body that was installed by the first trans mechanic will work properly. A 1995 F5 case can only use a F0 - F5 accumulator valve body.
.
I think its best to find out which E4OD "Design Level" Case you have in your truck; either a 95 / 96 or 98. You can verify the case by the Rough Forge casting number located just above and rear of the shift lever, drivers side of the case. It will start off with RF-F?xx-xxxxxx We need to I.D. the number where I place the ? mark in my example.

Hopefully, you have a F6 or F8 case and that indeed a 4R100 accumulator valve body was installed that matches it.

Additionally, there is a way to by-pass all electrical control and have the E4OD go in to what is called LIMP MODE (manual / hydraulic control) by simply pulling out the Solenoid Connector from the transmission. In LIMP MODE the transmission will take out in 2nd gear and then shift directly to O.D. (4th gear). I know some one that drove there F-250 diesel in LIMP MODE for 3 years until he could save enough for a rebuild.

Does your trans shift 2nd to OD when in LIMP MODE ? or does it still have same shifting issue ?

Also, if you want to get better understanding of the E4OD design, check out my E4OD Free Tips eBook that has been downloaded from download.com over 7,100 times. You can see the online version here: http://e4od.com/index.php/2015-01-18-18-51-55



Bobby