Rotor and pad suggestions to improve braking

Greenie

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My '93 F-250 has always had poor braking since new. The rear drums probably do 10% of the work, the front disks could be better. The current disks are gouged.
On another vehicle I tried slotted and drilled rotors and was very happy. The quality matters too - some Chinese rotors rust overnight.
I'm looking for suggestions on rotors and also the type of pads that might provide better stopping.
 

Booyah45828

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We use wagner pads in the shop, mainly the thermoquiet line, but I've also used their severe duty line as well. We install the cheapest coated rotors, as most are junk steel and rust easily.

I don't like drilled rotors, as they seem to crack over time.

We have a customer who had a 93 f250 with "soft" brakes. They weren't really soft per say, but they were like how you described, little rear input and disappointing front performance.

I was considering upgrading him to hydroboost, and then I found a tsb from ford and read about installing a larger bore master cylinder and wheel cylinders. I did that on his, and it made a night and day difference in stopping power, and made it so the rears actually felt like they were doing something. The parts I used were from a 96 superduty. I think the wheel cylinders went for 1" to 1 1/8" diameter, and the master went from 1" to 1 1/4" diameter. All I remember was the truck went from sketchy as hell when loaded to pretty impressive stopping power.

So instead of fancy pads and rotors, that would be the route I would take. Unless you already have that stuff installed.
 

cre1992

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I just put these on the front of my F-350 when I swapped srw hubs onto my Dana 60. They were recommended to me, figured I would give them a shot. I bought them on Amazon and they were here the next day. However these trucks are known to not be the best at stopping. Which is why many people hydroboost them. I plan on doing that someday, but I have a large list of other things to address first.

Raybestos 6084 Advanced Technology Disc Brake Rotor

Bendix Fleet Metlok MKD120FM Brake Pads
 

u2slow

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Hydroboost. Whole new level of stopping.
 

Daniel McCurdy

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Don't know if your truck is 2wd or 4wd but if it's 2wd I seen a thread where a guy put rotors and caliper from a 2008 and newer ford E-350 and it was literally bolt in didn't have to do anything.
 

Farmer Rock

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Don't know if your truck is 2wd or 4wd but if it's 2wd I seen a thread where a guy put rotors and caliper from a 2008 and newer ford E-350 and it was literally bolt in didn't have to do anything.
IIRC, the superduty's have a different lug pattern, so there would have to be some machining done I would imagine.




Rock
 

Greenie

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The truck is a 4WD, just put a new master cylinder on it last summer.
 

Daniel McCurdy

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It's all good. For the 2wd trucks it should be quite the upgrade the rotors are almost 1/2in larger in diameter and thickness it also looks like the calipers are bigger. There's a lot of additional braking power to be had there.
 

03wr250f

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We use wagner pads in the shop, mainly the thermoquiet line, but I've also used their severe duty line as well. We install the cheapest coated rotors, as most are junk steel and rust easily.

I don't like drilled rotors, as they seem to crack over time.

We have a customer who had a 93 f250 with "soft" brakes. They weren't really soft per say, but they were like how you described, little rear input and disappointing front performance.

I was considering upgrading him to hydroboost, and then I found a tsb from ford and read about installing a larger bore master cylinder and wheel cylinders. I did that on his, and it made a night and day difference in stopping power, and made it so the rears actually felt like they were doing something. The parts I used were from a 96 superduty. I think the wheel cylinders went for 1" to 1 1/8" diameter, and the master went from 1" to 1 1/4" diameter. All I remember was the truck went from sketchy as hell when loaded to pretty impressive stopping power.

So instead of fancy pads and rotors, that would be the route I would take. Unless you already have that stuff installed.
This guy is on the money.
@Booyah45828 we found Bosch quiet cast rotors (oreillys) and wagner oeX pads was the answer to great brakes that didn't warp or fade. Had tons of customers warp rotors even with proper torquing and break in before we switched to this setup.. after no more warped rotors. Bummer is they dont make quiet cast for 4wd trucks .

For op when was the front last done? Rear?
Have you had drums turned?new wheel cylinders? New full hardware?

How about front? Rotors, calipers, pads, hoses?

I can tell you it was amazing how much better my front started braking after new hoses and calipers. I haven't done pads or rotors, because I'm swapping axles soon

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Greenie

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"For op when was the front last done? Rear?" The front had rebuilt calipers 15 years ago - and possibly rotors but I can't recall. It's been a long time.
"Have you had drums turned?new wheel cylinders? New full hardware?" The rear has had new shoes, cylinders, and drums 6 years ago - all that work made hardly any difference in the overall stopping ability of the truck.

"How about front? Rotors, calipers, pads, hoses?" Hoses are probably original - they don't leak but may absorb some energy as they are most likely 28 years old. I will soak the fittings with PB and replace the front hoses when I replace the calipers. The steel lines are pretty solid - this truck doesn't go on the roads during the winter and hasn't for the last 15 years. Thanks for the reminder about hoses!

I've seen cracks in these rotors before so I'll pass on the drilled rotors but will spring for a higher quality steel with slots. As Booyah said, the drilled holes are probably going to encourage cracks.

I would like to find dust shields but as noted they don't appear to be available now.
 

Big Bart

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Some thoughts -


All of us should always think about your safety and your trucks well-being when selecting brakes and how far to go. This is not the place to use cheap parts or do things half baked. These trucks are hard to find with low miles, now that you have yours dialed in, invest in the stopping power and keep your truck around for another 30-40 years! :) You bought these trucks to haul loads, so repair the brakes like you are going to tow heavy loads.


1) I have seen rubber brake lines swell over time, restricting the flow/pressure of the brake fluid from the master cylinder. I have not seen a brake hose all out fail, but many that were cracked and on the way. Also, for those in areas with salt roads in winter, keep an eye out for corroded hard brake lines. They will leak/burst if left too long.

One time my friends had a VW Vanagon, the front brakes would not even bleed, 100% blocked from the rubber aging and ballooning. I was struggling to call out the lines, but the MC was newer. After testing the fitting before and after the rubber line, it turned out to be the rubber line was 100% blocked. Thus I am fan of replacing brake hoses after 100K or 10 years when you do the brakes next.

2) Not all pads are created equal! Get the best pads you can afford. (Cost does not always mean quality, but generally it does.) Most auto parts stores have cheap, middle of the road (Semi-metallic), and top of line brake pads. (Ceramic). Avoid the cheap and get the best you can afford.

3) Not all rotors and drums are created equal! Most auto parts stores have different grades/prices. Think metal make up, some are made out of a better quality steel that wears and warps slower. As mentioned above the Bosch rotors are more top of the line, used to have a lifetime warranty for the vehicle you put them on! Always plan to replace the rotors and drums, get the best you can afford. Let the brake pads/shoes chew up your rotors and drums! Resurfacing them only diminishes them in multiple ways.(It can work, but usually after 15K miles you will regret it. The now thinner metal will heat up faster and retain more heat. Thinner metal is apt warp, thus why so many cars and trucks have a steering wheel shimmy when you slow down, or after you really slowed down! (Could have been resurfaced or just a cheap rotor or drum used.) Also are your old rotors/drums quality factory ones or did someone put on cheapy’s and now you have thinner super cheapy’s! Not all machine shops can resurface a true and straight rotor or drum. (Overtime you will start to get steering shimmy or drum pulsing on the brakes. Now you have to start all over again.) Vented rotors stay cooler than solid rotors, so if your truck came with vented rotors, or it’s an option, put vented rotors back on. Slotted and drilled can help with heat, but also reduces the surface area. Have not tried these on a truck so others can weigh in. Above someone did not have a good experience, but maybe due to quality not design or use case. My advice just replace and have that peace of mind you did a the best job you could!

4) Get quality rebuilt calipers (Or new) and brand-new brake cylinders for the rear when replacing. They can go longer and are safer than re-using or buying a rebuild kit. The theory is not to have a brake failure, not hope it all works out on the cheap.

5) Make sure the vacuum pump, vacuum system, and brake booster are all working correctly. 1/2 of the braking power as you have probably learned over your life is that vacuum booster assisting pushing the master cylinder in. It is doing 50-80% of the work pushing on the master cylinder to compress that brake fluid and send it to the brake lines. Lack of vacuum or leaky brake booster and you lose braking power. Not a brake pad, rotor, caliper, cylinder problem. These trucks are old and those boosters are getting tired.

6) Have great trailer brakes! Making your truck stop with something more than a single jet ski trailer should be via assistance with trailer brakes.

a) Surge brakes are ok but generally fail in a couple of years. (Then slide and bang on accelerating and braking.) They also only work when you slow down the truck first and need constant adjustment. They are cheaper to install so trailer manufactures who are price conscious use these. Use disc trailer brakes when possible, stop faster! Note there are surge brake heads for drum and others for disc, so if you change over I suggest you change both over.

b) Electric brakes work much better but they do not like being dunked in water. (The set up is usually Steel drum brakes, regular shoes, with electric actuators that act like a wheel cylinder on your back brakes.) Good for flat bed or enclosed trailers that do not see much water. You can use electric brakes to get you out of a trailer sway issue! Use the slide on the controller to apply the brakes and your trailer will straighten out because the trailer is trying to slow up the truck and pulls tight.

c) Electric over hydraulic works awesome and when used with stainless steel calipers and rotors hold up to dunking in water. (Even salt water) It took me several attempts to get my boat trailer brakes to a point they did not rust out every 3-4 years. Now they look great even after sitting for months. You can use electric brakes to get you out of a trailer sway issue! Use the slide on the controller to apply the brakes and your trailer will straighten out because the trailer is trying to slow up the truck and pulls tight.

d) Also make sure you have a quality brake controller if using electric brakes. Check out the Tekonsha Prodigy 3 if in the market for one. (Prodigy 2 is ok if on a budget, have used both, both are good controllers.) Both do electric and electric over hydraulic and have great sensitivity settings to get your truck and trailer slowing in unison. Sometimes cheaper controllers can brake uneven, too hard, or too soft, leaving the truck doing more, or getting pulled to a stop.

e) Keep your trailering wiring in top notch condition. Trailer and brake wiring needs yearly attention so be sure to test and replace bad connections, frayed wiring, and corroded connectors. Bad wiring, no brakes, hope you stop in time!

f) One last lesson learned and some cheap advice that will save your bacon! I suggest using chains not 3” straps for holing down heavy loads like a car, jeep, or side by side. Just a little slack and the strap hook can unhook, now your load is unstable. It takes inches of chain slack for a chain hook to come loose. I learned the hard way! If you use straps do yourself a favor. Take a zip tie and zip tie the strap metal hook in place so it cannot fall off. If the trailer or load flexes or moves, then the hook cannot unhook and fall off.(Zip tie keeps the hook in place, till strap is taught.) Imagine you hit a big pothole, your trailer flexes and your load compresses one inch, your 1” strap hook/hooks just fell off. If you zip tied it, the hook would have stayed put, when the load uncompressed and the trailer flattened out, your hook and strap are in place and tight once again.


You can be thrifty on other auto parts and accessories but your safety and your truck’s life depend on being able to stop at all times. So going cheap on brakes will cause you pain and suffering later. (Maybe a whole lot of pain!)


Never tried an upgrade to the brakes but sounds worth some investigation if the above does not bring the truck up to *****.
 
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