Super Duty Axles

[gatorman21218]

Haha I got one

Me- hey hand me the sawzall I need it
Friend- This aint a sawzall this is a Dewalt Recipricating saw
Me- Well it saws metal, wood, plastic, rubber dont it?
Friend - Yeah I guess it does
Me- well so its a sawzall

 

[gatorman21218]

OK Back to topic. If you swap just one axle (say front) unless you changes the hubs you would have two different lug patterns which in the least make you carry two spares. I guess anything is better than a d44 (which I got)

 

[timothyr1014]

thats what I am trying to avoid, I just cant think of any 4x front axle that is 10 lug...on the 86 I am building I really want a 4x4 dually sitting on 19.5"s alcoas....and I am not big on adapters

 

[rjjp]

Frame width is different, unless your F350 was an unfinished truck. Spring hangers are farther apart. Plus you're stuck with some pretty deep gears unless you want to shell out a lot of cash, 5.13 and 4.63 were stock, but you can get down to 4.10 with the same carrier it's just very expensive. I believe that you can get 10 lug hubs for a Dana 70 front but don't quote me on that.

LCAM, In the 88 F-Superduty that my dad scrapped (Still have back axle and ZF5 52000mi) It had the 460, a ZF-5, Dana 80 with 4.63, and a 5000lb Rockwell carryall.

 

[Hyde]

Just to let you know the Super Duty (99+) front axles use unit bearing hubs.

 

[sootman73]

thats what I am trying to avoid, I just cant think of any 4x front axle that is 10 lug...on the 86 I am building I really want a 4x4 dually sitting on 19.5"s alcoas....and I am not big on adapters

now i can understand that you aren't keen on adpaters but there are a lot of people that use adapters everyday to ow probably a lot more than this older truck can tow. those contractors in diesel power that run 19.5s use adpators and pull skid steers and job trailers up and down hills with truck three to four times as powerful. i would think that they have proven themselves to work just fine......

 

[snicklas]

Just to let you know the Super Duty (99+) front axles use unit bearing hubs.

Unfortunatly, yes. I am very nice to mine...... I do not want to have to replace one of them..... I think they are like $250 - 300 bucks each..... Makes one consider the conversion option, but I do like the ESOF since this is my winter get to work vehicle......

 

[George_7.3IDI]

Unfortunatly, yes. I am very nice to mine...... I do not want to have to replace one of them..... I think they are like $250 - 300 bucks each..... Makes one consider the conversion option, but I do like the ESOF since this is my winter get to work vehicle......

What's ESOF?

 

[Hyde]

Unfortunatly, yes. I am very nice to mine...... I do not want to have to replace one of them..... I think they are like $250 - 300 bucks each..... Makes one consider the conversion option, but I do like the ESOF since this is my winter get to work vehicle......

For this case with retrofitting the axle the conversion doesnt seem like it would be an option. The cost of the axle plus a $1500 conversion to bearings and hubs is a lot more than you would pay for a good ol kingpin Dana 60. In your case it might be an option though, I know some people that have never had to replace one, others that go through em like a consumable

 

[snicklas]

What's ESOF?

Geroge,

Electronic Shift On the Fly. With the 4x4 system in my truck or any of the 99 and up trucks. The have an auto/manual lockout on them. I can turn the "knob" on them and lock them in 100% of the time just like good old lockouts. However, if I have them unlocked, and I turn the switch in the cab to 4x4, vacuum is applied to the lockouts and they will lock in, the t-case shifts and I am in 4x4 until I turn the switch back to 2-hi. This is really nice in heavy rain and snowy conditions, that if needed while running down ther road I can switch to 4-hi and everything locks in and I am in 4x4 even if the lockouts were unlocked. The down side of this system, these axles use a unit bearing hub, not a "spindle and bearing" hub. So there is a replaceable unit that has the hub and bearing as an unserviceable unit, you just swap everything out, which does give you a new "everything" in there, but 1 unit bearing unit is abour $300. On the D-60 for example, you can buy replacement bearings for both sides and all the accompanying seals for maybe 50 or 60 bucks for the whole axle, and you are good. To replace the same "bearing" in my truck would be 6 or 700 bucks......

There is a company that makes a conversion kit to goto the "old style" spindle and bearing setup but that kit is something like $1500. That seems steep, but they use a standard bearing so you can get them cheap..... so if you are going to keep the truck for a long time, you may actuall come out ahead if you get the conversion kit, because "rebuilding" the front twice is about the same price. The ony bad thing is, this kit uses standard lockouts, so you loose the ESOF feature, but you do gain the ability to use 2-lo which I do not have the ability to do......

 

[snicklas]

For this case with retrofitting the axle the conversion doesnt seem like it would be an option. The cost of the axle plus a $1500 conversion to bearings and hubs is a lot more than you would pay for a good ol kingpin Dana 60. In your case it might be an option though, I know some people that have never had to replace one, others that go through em like a consumable

Hyde,

I have almost a 100k on mine, and they are still the factory hubs. However, I do not take the truck off road. It is my tow vehicle and my winter vehicle, so the hubs do not take the beating that some get. I hope to keep them in service for a long time. If needed, at least once I will just replace the unit hubs, but if it seems like it wants to start eating the units, I would probally look into going with the conversion. I like the ESOF, but I did have an 83 F-150 that had manual lockouts and a manual t-case so I am used to either. If I did go with the conversion kit, when winter rolled around I would just lock the lockouts in and leave them that way till spring.... then I would still be able to shift on the fly, like I did in the 83.....

 

[LCAM-01XA]

A little more on topic...will f-superduty axles bolt under an f350 (more or less plug and play style)?, and if so are there any options for going 4x4 with 10-lug wheels?

If the F350 was a stripped-chassis (also known as cab-chassis) truck when it left the factory then the D80 rear from the F-Superduty will bolt right up to its springs. However, since that D80 has no parking brakes built in it, you'll have to devise some sort of a driveline brake - the F-Superduty has that on the back of the trans, essentially it's a 4x4 transmission with a driveline brake instead of a trasfer case bolted to it. As for the 4x4 front axle and keeping the 10-lug wheels, I'm not aware of any 4x4 F-Superduty trucks that left the factory that way, I've seen some but I don't really know what front axle was used in those.

I know of a guy on FSC who converted his 3500HD (essentially Chevy's version of the F-Superduty) to 4x4, he used a regular D60 axle and then had adapters made from the 8 on 6.5 bolt pattern to whatever the 10-lug Chev bolt pattern is.

Also the 10-lug bolt pattern Ford used may not necessarily be the same as the 10-lug pattern you're thinking of with them 19.5" Alcoas, so you better make sure the Alcoas will fit on the D80 rear before you even start thinking of making the 4x4 front into a 10-lug setup.

And here's one question - why not just use the 1-ton axle the F350 came with (or are widely available for it), and run 8-lug 19.5" Alcoa wheels? IIRC this is exactly what Chris (diesel4me2) has done to his '80s dually...

 

[snicklas]

One question/consern that I have always had with the F-Superduty. I have always been under the impression the "mechanical" brakes that are normally affixed to the rear axle of a vehicle, were a parking/"emergency" brakes. Such that if the primary braking system fails, being hydraulic, air, cables.... whatever were to fail, this brake would provide some braking to slow/stop a vehicle if there was a failure. In this setup with the machanical brake being attached to the transmission end of the driveshaft instead of the rear wheels, is this considered an "emergency" brake or just a parking brake? I knon on some older MD trucks and School Busses they also used a driveline brake as you describe.

I there were some catrostrofic failure, and the primary/service brakes failed and you applied this driveline brake and say, a U-Joint fails.... what do you do? Starting looking for a "soft-looking" Prius? I know this is a unique situation.... but...... I thought you had to have an "emergency brake" on vehicle.......

 

[jam0o0]

ford's f-suyperduty and f450 superduty are not the same as big rig ten bolt.

you can get a small ten lug D60 from ford. called the super 60. i think it's 8 grand.

driveline mechanical brakes count as emergency brakes and are very common in medium and heavy duty trucks and equipment.

 

[White Trash]

One thing to consider is if you are seriously considering dumping $1500 into a conversion kit from dynatrac to have real wheel bearings why not just swap an older axle in there and adapt the abs tone ring onto it? Having a converted axle only makes it more expensive should something happen to the proprietary parts used in that kit. Say you lose a wheel bearing, you are the mercy of dynatrac to get another spindle. Not something I'd be into for sure...