New to the 6.9L IDI Family! :)

gooter87

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Hey Ya'll,

Glad I was able to find an active 6.9L forum! :)

So recently i bought a new to me, 1985 F250 2x4 with a 6.9L Diesel. Talk about a new project!

I am having a few problems with it. Any input, feedback, or suggestions would be amazing, as i am fairly new to diesel repair, but have a good knowledge of gassers, i think i can figure this out.

1) Fuel Levels in both tanks stays at or below Empty on the dash gauge. I have looked and looked and see that the issue is the sending unit located in tank, but have not been able to find any replacements that have good reviews and work correctly. My question is, can these be cleaned and repaired? Is it possible the float has a hole in it due to age?

2) I am noticing a lot of white smoke during warm up idle, and subsiding after complete warm up. The white/blue smoke is there after warm up, but not as bad. My question regarding this is could it be the head gasket? I have seen a lot of posts about the 6.9 IDI having head gasket problems. I do not notice the sweet antifreeze smell in the exhaust, but notice a sweet antifreeze smell under the hood after its been driven for awhile. Do not see any leaks, and do not see oil in the anti freeze, but did notice when its cold outside (below 40 degrees F) that steam or smoke is coming out of the dipstick tube for the oil. So that has a bit of a concern for HG issues.

3) In dash tachometer fluctuates A LOT. By that being said, it stays at 0 RPM to about 500 RPM during cold idle. While driving, it bounces all over, never passing 2000 RPM, even when getting on it. I have checked the wiring from the Tach sending unit next to the neck of the oil filler and it seems good. Would you think it is the actual tach in the truck or tach sending unit?

4) I produce a lot of smoke when i get on it.. seems like too much if you ask me... i look like a ridiculous 16Vlave Cummins a 17 year old has and just wants to roll coal. hahaha What could be the cause of this? I checked out the injector pump, it looks OK, but i don't know if what i am looking for can be seen by the naked eye. I did notice that on the top of atleast 2 of my injectors, i see that it looks wet where the fuel line from the IP connects. Smells like fresh diesel. What should I be checking to get this taken care of where i wont roll coal like a train.

Thanks in advance, it know its alot to read, but this is going to be my new DD and rec truck.

-ziggy



**YOU MAY HAVE TO CLICK THE BLUE DOWNLOAD BUTTON AT TOP RIGHT OF PAGE IF VIDEO IS CHOPPY**

After Warm Up - https://www.dropbox.com/s/w98f9fbhcrms13t/AfterWarmUp.MOV?dl=0

Before Warm Up - https://www.dropbox.com/s/zlyjlo4eyapq8p6/BeforeWarmUp.MOV?dl=0

Tach at Idle with Revs - https://www.dropbox.com/s/2u9z4dyg04c1c54/IMG_0249.MOV?dl=0

Tach Normal Driving - https://www.dropbox.com/s/a0j1brpms1s9bfq/IMG_0250.MOV?dl=0

Tach during quick acceleration - https://www.dropbox.com/s/95843qxum0l1phj/IMG_0251.MOV?dl=0
 
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opusd2

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Welcome to the group, and to your newest addiction and project! The best part is that you will eventually know your entire vehicle, every nuance and gremlin (sounds like you are well on your way there!). But you'll never find a more diverse and informative group of fellow addicts anyplace else.

I myself have an 86 F250 project that has its share of "peculiarities" and with the help of all my friends here, am making it (albeit slowly) into the truck I've always wanted. And with ever modification, upgrade, change, of parts, it'll be more a part of you than just a vehicle.

Congratulations on your purchase, and for making your way here!
 

gandalf

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Welcome to the best Ford diesel forum going. You'll find more knowledge about these older diesels here on Oil Burners than you will at almost any Ford dealer. They usually don't want to be bothered.

Fuel level gauge--- I think I noticed that you have no rear fuel tank. Am I right? If that is the case then somebody has also been messing with the fuel level sending units and the wiring. Slide in under the truck, about at the rear of the driver side door. Look at the fuel selector valve for anything which doesn't look right. Check the wire at the rear tank location to be sure it's not just dangling, free to flap around in the wind. Also, there is probably a fuse involved in there somewhere.

Your tach---You've found the sender. Good. That is probably your problem. They go wackey on occasion. Pull that sensor (~a 1 inch head on it) and clean it off. Take note of what is sticking to it. Clean it and replace it. If that improves things, it is more than likely a temporary fix. At that point start pricing a new one. Shop around. It may be a dealer only item.

I'll let others address the IP issues. What mileage is showing on the odometer? Remember that those things roll over at 100,000. The ip frequently needs rebuilding at about 125,000 miles.

Things to read here on the forum. Read the Hall of Shame, read it well and believe it. It's located as a sticky at the top of this section of the forum. Read the Tech articles. They are a treasure of good information. Thery will help you spend all your money too. The most important article for you right now is Mel's (Agnem) Article about the injection system. Read that one well, and I think it will help answer some of your questions.
 

Hydro-idi

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First off, welcome to the forum. We have many great members that are willing to take time out of their busy schedules to help others out. You will find that this is the best place for all questions regarding these old ford's.
Wheew, you have quite a list! I will try to answer them one at a time. Others will chime in on anything I may have missed.

1. As far as the fuel level reading, most idi owners experience these same symptoms. Replacement fuel senders/pickups....or whatever they are called, will be difficult to track down. The connection between the float/fuel sender can sometimes be cleaned with steel wool which may help with a more accurate reading. I suggest using your trip odometer after filling tanks. This is what I have done for several years because like yours, my fuel gauges no longer provide me with an accurate level reading. I know exactly how many miles I am able to go on each tank before theyneed to be filled.

2. If you do not have bubbles coming from radiator after cap has been removed (while running), or do not have coolant blowing out of overflow tank, you probably don't have a head gasket failure. I suspect this is a combination of worn out injectors and injection pump. The white smoke you are seeing is unburnt diesel fuel due to poor injector spray atomization, weak injection pump psi, and/or incorrect engine timing. If these components still have the factory ford gray paint, they are the originals and may need to be replaced soon.
Here's a link to a very reputable shop called conestoga diesel. He has top quality injection systems, turbo parts etc. His name is Mel and he is also a member here on OB. I would highly recommend him for his excellent customer service and quality engine parts he offers.
http://www.conestogadiesel.com/
If you are smelling coolant from engine compartment, you most likely have a leak somewhere. Coolant dye from your local auto parts store may help you identify leak easier.
The steam coming from dipstick tube is considered blowby and normal to an extent. Blowby is when combustion gases are getting squeezed past the piston rings. The gases accumulate in the engine bay and the CDR (crankcase depression regulator) will re-route those exhaust gases back into the intake manifold. These diesels have a very high compression ratio and blowby is fairly high, even on a rebuilt engine.

3. This is more than likely linked to a bad tachometer sensor. Here's a link below
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ford-6-9L-7...Parts_Accessories&hash=item2edaad8cc5&vxp=mtr

4. Again linked to a worn out injection system. You probably have a few or more leaking injectors that are not able to atomize fuel properly, thus causing the white/blue smoke. You may also have an injection pump that was turned up by the previous owner if you are seeing lots of black smoke. Turning up the fuel can be dangerous without a pyrometer. Temps can exceed past 1150 degrees F and melt pistons.
There is a plate on the passenger side of injection pump. Inside is a hex adjustment which will increase/decrease fuel output depending on which way it is turned. I would highly recommend replacing both injectors and injection pump at the same time. Sounds like you also need a fuel return line kit. Mel "Agnem" that owns conestoga diesel or Russ "typ4" have top quality return line kits with viton o-rings.

Ok, now the not so good news. Your warm up video has me concerned. Hear that popping sound coming from the exhaust at idle??? This is mostly related to a valvetrain issue. It sounds like you may have a bad valve/guide that is not sealing correctly and has increased tolerances. I would recommend pulling valve covers and inspecting rocker arms, springs, pushrods for any abnormalities. If you find a valve that has lots of blowby and oil coming from it....bingo. Worn valve guide which is rocking valve stem back and forth which will not allow valve to properly seat and needs to be fixed ASAP. Cylinder heads will need to be pulled and rebuilt by a reputable machine shop.
If everything checks out and you do not see/hear any problems, maybe you got lucky and this popping noise is coming from the worn out injection system.
 
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riotwarrior

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Welcome to OB...lets start by suggesting you READ FAQ's, those will assist you in many aspects of what you need to know.

WE have a good crowd here always online lots of help available.

Tons of info in the TECH section too.

Good luck with yer project.
 

gooter87

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Thanks for the welcome and all the great information.

The truck is sitting at 77,852..again.. not sure if 100K, 200K..etc...

To answer gandalf's question, I do have a front and rear tank in this truck. Just the door to the fuel filler for the rearhas been removed..not sure if on purpose or accident.. but it doesnt exist. This truck was purchased for $500 bucks from a guy who used it on his farm. So totally expected the dents, dings and missing parts.. along with the free hay:)

This weekend will be pulling the bed off, and checking the sending units, and hopefully placing a newer, better shape box on. :) Maybe from a late 80's early 90s.. i was told any bed would fit from 80 - 94... havent verified.. but totally worth looking into.


As for the tach, i will do that this weekend, pulling, cleaning and inspecting to see if that corrects my problems.



Hydro-idi -

Thank you so much for going through the vids and reading what i had wrote... i know it was a lot and all i want to do is get Bertha, the truck, running in tip top shape. I have been just collecting a list of things that i want to replace or check into, and it got a little long due to her shape. She seems like a good strong truck, just need to give the TLC that other owners didnt.

I will check over the selector valve and wiring and see if anything looks funky.

Unfortunately i do not have a trip meter in this truck :( i was thinking about changing out the gauge cluster for one from a lariat or something to get that functionality to help monitor travel distance... i do keep a few gallons in the rear tank at all times in the event i run dry in tank 1... hasnt happend yet... :knock on wood: haha.

I will be checking with Mel at Conestoga Diesel to see what we can get worked out for injectors and return fuel return line kit.

As for the popping, not sure if this makes a difference, but it was straight piped from the two - 2 1/2" back with 3" pipe... Today, i added a flow master muffler to it.. was toooo loud, and neighbors were complaining of early morning warm up noise hahaha.;Sweet

But while it was up at the shop, i decided to take a gander under the truck completely lifted, without laying on the ground or my creeper.. and i noticed i was missing a cover where the trans connects to the motor.. looks the the flywheel is exposed..

Take a Look Here:

Missing Cover - https://www.dropbox.com/s/zrhn7u89lwavbms/IMG_0257.MOV?dl=0


It is good to know that there are people in this world that just want to help others in an honest fashion. This is going to be my project for the next few months.. Hope to take her back to how she looked in 85!:)

I appreciate all the input... this has at least given me the ability to start in a direction!:hail




First off, welcome to the forum. We have many great members that are willing to take time out of their busy schedules to help others out. You will find that this is the best place for all questions regarding these old ford's.
Wheew, you have quite a list! I will try to answer them one at a time. Others will chime in on anything I may have missed.

1. As far as the fuel level reading, most idi owners experience these same symptoms. Replacement fuel senders/pickups....or whatever they are called, will be difficult to track down. The connection between the float/fuel sender can sometimes be cleaned with steel wool which may help with a more accurate reading. I suggest using your trip odometer after filling tanks. This is what I have done for several years because like yours, my fuel gauges no longer provide me with an accurate level reading. I know exactly how many miles I am able to go on each tank before theyneed to be filled.

2. If you do not have bubbles coming from radiator after cap has been removed (while running), or do not have coolant blowing out of overflow tank, you probably don't have a head gasket failure. I suspect this is a combination of worn out injectors and injection pump. The white smoke you are seeing is unburnt diesel fuel due to poor injector spray atomization, weak injection pump psi, and/or incorrect engine timing. If these components still have the factory ford gray paint, they are the originals and may need to be replaced soon.
Here's a link to a very reputable shop called conestoga diesel. He has top quality injection systems, turbo parts etc. His name is Mel and he is also a member here on OB. I would highly recommend him for his excellent customer service and quality engine parts he offers.
http://www.conestogadiesel.com/
If you are smelling coolant from engine compartment, you most likely have a leak somewhere. Coolant dye from your local auto parts store may help you identify leak easier.
The steam coming from dipstick tube is considered blowby and normal to an extent. Blowby is when combustion gases are getting squeezed past the piston rings. The gases accumulate in the engine bay and the CDR (crankcase depression regulator) will re-route those exhaust gases back into the intake manifold. These diesels have a very high compression ratio and blowby is fairly high, even on a rebuilt engine.

3. This is more than likely linked to a bad tachometer sensor. Here's a link below
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ford-6-9L-7...Parts_Accessories&hash=item2edaad8cc5&vxp=mtr

4. Again linked to a worn out injection system. You probably have a few or more leaking injectors that are not able to atomize fuel properly, thus causing the white/blue smoke. You may also have an injection pump that was turned up by the previous owner if you are seeing lots of black smoke. Turning up the fuel can be dangerous without a pyrometer. Temps can exceed past 1150 degrees F and melt pistons.
There is a plate on the passenger side of injection pump. Inside is a hex adjustment which will increase/decrease fuel output depending on which way it is turned. I would highly recommend replacing both injectors and injection pump at the same time. Sounds like you also need a fuel return line kit. Mel "Agnem" that owns conestoga diesel or Russ "typ4" have top quality return line kits with viton o-rings.

Ok, now the not so good news. Your warm up video has me concerned. Hear that popping sound coming from the exhaust at idle??? This is mostly related to a valvetrain issue. It sounds like you may have a bad valve/guide that is not sealing correctly and has increased tolerances. I would recommend pulling valve covers and inspecting rocker arms, springs, pushrods for any abnormalities. If you find a valve that has lots of blowby and oil coming from it....bingo. Worn valve guide which is rocking valve stem back and forth which will not allow valve to properly seat and needs to be fixed ASAP. Cylinder heads will need to be pulled and rebuilt by a reputable machine shop.
If everything checks out and you do not see/hear any problems, maybe you got lucky and this popping noise is coming from the worn out injection system.
 

Hydro-idi

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Even a straight piped truck should never make that popping sound at idle. This is why I believe you have a valvetrain issue that will need to be addressed sooner than later. But if you are going to replace injection system, I would start there and get the fuel system freshened up before jumping to the conclusion that it is a valvetrain issue. You will then know for sure that you have a valve problem if you replace them and still have exhaust pop/chuff.
I never had much luck with cleaning the tachometer sensor. I tried it a couple times but finally bought a new one. That solved the erratic rpm gauge. But hey, it's worth a try.
 

Hydro-idi

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The injectors look like the originals. Not so sure if the injection pump is original or not. It is always a good idea to replace both items at the same time. The attachment is not working for me but your video revealed the side plate with the 2 bolts holding it on. That is the plate where the fuel adjustment screw is located.
Looks like someone pieced together the fuel return lines and also looks like your fuel supply line is leaking where it connects to injection pump. There is a rubber olive in there that will need to be replaced. A good quality return line kit will come with those olives.
 

gooter87

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Looks like someone pieced together the fuel return lines and also looks like your fuel supply line is leaking where it connects to injection pump. There is a rubber olive in there that will need to be replaced. A good quality return line kit will come with those olives.


Would it be a good idea to do both stock IP and injectors with the aftermarket new fuel return kit? I know there hasnt been much done to this baby, and i would hate to put a high flow pump and injectors and melt a piston, or crack the infamous HG hahaha.

Yes it looks pieced together to me as well, but i am looking for a challenge to get her back to life. :)
 

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