Anyone run synthetic or 10w30 in the winter?

idiabuse

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That's got to be a typo. That's even smaller than what the factory originally sized them to.

Do you mean "fifteen thousandths" as in .015? That's a good amount of wear.

Or "one and a half thousandths" as in .0015? Even this amout of wear is negligible let alone .00015

Ya typo! one and a half thousnands wear Thanks!


Javier
 

RLDSL

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I run the PSD size filter and a bypass, and Amsoil 15w 40 synthetic year round. with a quality synthetic, you really make the cold start thing a moot point as pour point gets dpwn lower than what the thing is going to fire at without a block heater plugged in at anyway most get down around -40 . Its not like dino 15w40 that starts turning to pudding at 0 deg f if its not plugged in
 

jwalterus

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I run 15w40 Superlube TMS (Cenex brand) year round
of course, my engine has 2 block heaters and a circulating coolant heater.......
4 seconds on the GPs at -15 and I'm running ;Sweet
 

tanman_2006

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I've been running amsoil dual bypass with 15/40 amsoil since I bought my 95,barely uses any oil. I've recently gotten to 5k on Rotella 15/40 with auto rx and have almost used a qt, it's a rough life. Maybe the auto rx will stop it from being such oil gulping beast lol. I will go back to amsoil after the flush stage.

On the other hand my 93 K3500 can use 1qt/500 miles of Rotella 15/40 but with Delo 400 that is cut in 1/2, this truck will get auto rx double dose when I finally get done setting it up (rebuilt nv4500, new clutch, new interior, new turbo, injectors are boxed and going to Mel in the AM, new glows are in, new glow cables and battery cables are waiting)

both rigs start fine anytime, even unplugged. My 93 was a bit shakey but when I took it down for a clutch the project grew. My 95 needs a new set of squirts but other than that I have 12sec of glow time and programmed after heat to keep it clean after its running based on engine temp, started in - 37 and 2 blizzards and I don't plan on that changing.
 
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Silver Burner

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Have you BEEN outside this week after sundown?! Lol, it has been a tad nippy for the last couple weeks though.

Hey, where are you at? Not sure if I've seen you around, but you're definitely close! And yes, my truck has been frozen over the last few mornings, but it starts up like someone lit a fire under its **** every time I go out there. She's pretty healthy right now. :D
 

FORDF250HDXLT

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this thread has gotten me interested in this;
http://www.amsoil.com/lit/databulletins/g1301.pdf

being in Maine,i could pretty much run the stuff year round.maybe just switch back to 40w in july and aug for our few 90 degree+ weather.

but how do you guys buy the stuff? you have to order it online.that kinda sucks,but i guess i can get over it.just have to make sure to order more than needed.always keep a spare gallon cus you cant just buy it off the shelf.thats a ******.

10w30 is recommended for 90f and below.
Now I use 10W30 SAE 30 weight synthetic and use the PSD size filter that is an high efficency filter like the 1734XE WIX but from another source.
I get excellent MPG over 20 in the city and am very happy with my truck.
Javier

Haynes diesel tech book #10330:
api grade sf/cd or sf/ce
10w-30 ........ consistently below 30 degrees F but ok for up to 90 degree F.

so seems wise to only run a weight required.running 40w most of the time like i have been,has been a waste of fuel really.

though over 20mpg city,does seem pretty........optimistic, there idiabuse.


edit;
good deal on amsoil here:
http://www.woodsbrosracing.com/

what you do is select what you want,and do a price quote.you'll get an instant automated e-mail (check spam folder) along with payment options right in it.
i got some new juice coming.see how this treats her.
also,a little off topic.but im going back to Mobil 1 Synthetic Gear Lube LS 75W-90 instead of the thicker 75W-140.i don't care if it does ware my r&p more.it's cheaper to replace parts than it is to spend more in fuel now.
oh,then that was dumb.i could have just ordered amsoils gear lube while i was at it lol.oops.
 
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jrad235

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Just hanging out around the corner. I've actually been driving the truck the last week instead of the Subaru because I can't get into the 'Ru when it's frozen. The truck doesn't put up much of a fight, and starts right up. Amazing what good plugs, batteries, and a starter can do for ya. I've seen a couple trucks that are SIMILAR to yours, but I just noticed the black canopy on the back. You MAY have driven past my house once. Sometime this summer.
 

fordf350man

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when the engine is warm it is much warmer than 90f, what im saying is the manufacturer test engines in extreme conditions like high and low temperatures and that is what they find to work best, i work in the prototype field with ford, Ive seen what they do and how they test engines, you really shouldn't change what they recommend especially on new engine, allot of timing chain tensioners rely on that just right oil type to prevent premature wear, if its cold out let it warm up, if its hot out, if everything works the way it should it still shouldn't overheat, if it does there are other problems with the vehicle
 

RLDSL

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this thread has gotten me interested in this;
http://www.amsoil.com/lit/databulletins/g1301.pdf

being in Maine,i could pretty much run the stuff year round.maybe just switch back to 40w in july and aug for our few 90 degree+ weather.

but how do you guys buy the stuff? you have to order it online.that kinda sucks,but i guess i can get over it.just have to make sure to order more than needed.always keep a spare gallon cus you cant just buy it off the shelf.thats a ******.




Haynes diesel tech book #10330:
api grade sf/cd or sf/ce
10w-30 ........ consistently below 30 degrees F but ok for up to 90 degree F.

so seems wise to only run a weight required.running 40w most of the time like i have been,has been a waste of fuel really.

though over 20mpg city,does seem pretty........optimistic, there idiabuse.


edit;
good deal on amsoil here:
http://www.woodsbrosracing.com/

what you do is select what you want,and do a price quote.you'll get an instant automated e-mail (check spam folder) along with payment options right in it.
i got some new juice coming.see how this treats her.
also,a little off topic.but im going back to Mobil 1 Synthetic Gear Lube LS 75W-90 instead of the thicker 75W-140.i don't care if it does ware my r&p more.it's cheaper to replace parts than it is to spend more in fuel now.
oh,then that was dumb.i could have just ordered amsoils gear lube while i was at it lol.oops.

The 5w-30 amsoil you link to is really for slightly more modern diesels and car diesels. I have spoken at length with the tech folks at Amsoil about the correct oil for these engines and barring pure arctic conditions, the 15w-40 diesel and marine is the ideal engine oil Itll pour clean at -40 and you should be plugged in before that. I spent a LOT of time in arctic conditions with big diesels and even if you can fire without plugging, it's not a good idea below a certain point. THe drastic instant temperature change is extremely harsh on an engine and can lead to cracks and gasket blow outs It used to be common practice on the big trucks to leave them running if the temps were to go below anywhere from 10 above to 0 f if there was no plug in available I wouldnt want to stretch it much beyond -25-30 even with a synthetic that can go to -45 to -60, you are simply torturing the material in your engine without having it plugged in. If you are going to operate in those kinds of temps you should have access to an outlet or install a diesel fired block heater ( in case anyone ever wondered why the europeans have this annoying little habit of getting insanely long lifespans out of their diesels and gas models, it could have a lot to do with the fact that most all of them come from the factory with fuel fired block heaters from the factory, and thats not just the fancy ones, its right on down to the VWs ... yet for some odd reason, those part numbers are not available in north america from any of the manufacturers)

You have to also remember that once the heads havce been worked on , on a 7.3 , they have teh 6.9 type umbrella exhaust guide seals that are intended to consume a bit ofoil as part of operation ( so anyone with a 7.3 who claims to use no oil at all is a liar, its part of the design, the correct thing would be to say that one doesnt need to add any between changes and that is possible with a tight engine ) When the 7.3 came from the factory it had positive valve stem seals on the exhaust same as teh intake, but that is what led to early exhaust guide demise so all subsequent kits come with umbrella seals same as teh 6.9 , to allow for extra oiling ( although some folks like me who have thorough trust in their oil and its extra protection, have gone ahead and installed positive seals on the exhaust guides at rebuild to lessen consumption so all this said, a lighter oil will be consumed by your engine at a faster rate. These older mid range engines have clearances that were not designed for light grade oils, and any fuel dilution will break a light oil down even more quickly
I've had the same 15w-40 diesel and marine in mine for around 80k miles with the last test at about 70k where it was still just fine
 

FORDF250HDXLT

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if 30 weight wasn't good enough,navistar wouldn't have said it was i figure.
they would have stated 40w was the minimum instead.
90 F doesn't mean engine oil/coolant temperature,or else 30w would never be good enough.that's ambient temps of course,because engine oil will get up to over 200 degrees in just a few miles running empty in the dead of winter.
mobil 1 diesel truck isn't really made for the older engines either.who really is running exactly api sf/cd? or api sf/ce?
i start instantly now on 5w 40.that's no issue.it's all about efficiency/economy.


"The 5w-30 amsoil you link to is really for slightly more modern diesels and car diesels."

SAE 15W-40 Synthetic Heavy Duty
Diesel & Marine Motor Oil
Engineered for pre-2007 diesel engines in on-road applications as well as all model year diesel engines in off-road applications. High 12 TBN controls acids from combustion blow-by and EGR. Additives control soot thickening, oxidation and wear. Extended drain capabilities reduce downtime and motor oil expenses.
• SAE 15W-40
• API CI-4+, CF, CF-2, SL
• ACEA A3/B3, E2, E3, E5, E7
• Global DHD-1
• JASO DH-1
• Mack EO-M, EO-N
• DDC 93K214
• Caterpillar ECF-1A, ECF-2
• Cummins CES 20076,
20077, 20078
• Volvo VDS-2, VDS-3
• MB 228.1, 228.3, 229.1
• MAN 271, 3275
• MTU Type II

.................
Series 3000 5W-30 Synthetic
Heavy Duty Diesel Oil
Engineered for pre-2007 diesel engines in on-road applications as well as all model year diesel engines in off-road applications. Also engineered for all gasoline engines recommending API SL specifications including turbo-charged vehicles. Provides superior wear protection and fuel efficiency.
• API CI-4+, CI-4, CH-4, CF-2, CF, SL
• ACEA A3/B3, E2, E3,E5, E7
• Global DHD-1
• JASO DH-1
• Mack EO-M+, EO-N
• DDC 93K214
•Caterpillar ECF-1-a, ECF-2
• Cummins CES20076, 20077, 20078
• Volvo VDS-2, VDS-3
• MB 228.1, 228.3,229.1
• MAN 271/3275 • MTU Type II
 

IDIDieselJohn

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My 7.3 has been on Valvoline 15W40 year round, although I did try some diesel 10W30 a few winters.


377k miles and only uses 2 quarts of oil per oil change interval (3500 miles)!

And my 2 other IDI's sleep all winter.
 

fordf350man

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i run motorcraft 10-30w, i get it from work, no issue starting it year round, i understand that that is ambient but what needs to be taken in consideration is when the engine is at operating temperature, it will warm up in short time like everyone knows thats when the oil is doing its work and when you need it most, im not saying other types wont work just thats what they recommend for a reason, they did all the hard work and testing and came up with that result, they do towing and high temp conditions and doing all those test they oil that they recommend is the one that performed best, you dont have to take there advice if you choose not to
 

PwrSmoke

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I've been running 10W30 HDEO for many years... year around. I'm talking on and off since 1987 (there were times in the early '90s when Rotella 10W30 was hard to find). With a truck that's been turbocharged since 1987. I've had great oil analysis with it and when I had the engine apart with the blown head gasket debacle, (truck has 140K miles) the cylinders had 0.001" taper or less. The bearings were reusable (I didn't though). Nothing else hard in the lower end needed replacement based on careful measurement. Did replace the rockers with the 7.3L style.

SAE 30 or 10W30 was one of the original recommendations for the 6.9L (all my original '86 owner literature and manuals show it) but was supersceded by 15W40 starting in '87 (which I found starting in the '87 books). I disagree that 10W30 doesn't provide "adequate lubrication." Like any oil, it depends on the circumstances. These are the climate, operational situation (both of which equate to operating oil temps) and the level of wear and tear on the engine.

I ran an engine oil temp gauge on mine for a time till the sender cacked (it was an oddball that I couldn't replace) and the sump temp on my truck seldom approached 200F. As most of you know, oil temp dictates operating viscosity and the actual viscosity grade of the oil is measured at 212F. So if the oil is at 12.1 cSt @ 212F (right at the top of the 30 grade area.. almost 40) then at the 190F the oil temp normally runs, the oil is running at about 14cSt which is smack dab in the center of the 40 grade area ( I determined this by using a temp/viscosity chart). At that temp, a 40 grade is running in low 50 grade territory. When the oil temp goes higher than 212F, then you start going the other direction. The 12.1 cSt 30 grade oil must go to 230F before it drops out of the 30 grade. A typical 40 grade (I'm working off Rotella info on both oils here, other oils are slightly different) at 230 has dropped to about 12cSt, (upper 30 grade) at that temp. A 40 grade must go to 250F to drop out of 30 grade territory.

Another good reason why 40 grade is recommended is fuel dilution. Fuel in the oil reduces the viscosity and it doesn't take all that much to drop a 40 grade down to a 30. Whether this is a problem depends on how you run your truck and the condition of the injection system. No matter what, a short hopper would have more trouble with fuel dilution because colds starts is when most of that happens and it takes heat and running to evaporate it out. When you do freeway type miles, fuel dilution generally isn't an issue unless you have a fuel system problem.

Soot thickening is an issue in diesels no matter what oil you use. As soot builds up in oil, it begins to thicken. It's interesting to see. At some point in the oil change interval, the oil will shear a little... lose some viscosity as the Viscosity Index Improvers (VII) wear out. Shearing isn't much of an issue with a good oil, but there is always a slight drop. Then, as soot builds up, the oil starts to get thicker again. I've seen the 40 grade viscosity in my IH tractor come out thicker than it went in due to soot... and only about 2% to boot!

Permanent shearing is also worth discussing... if only because people bring it up in oil discussions so much. Yes, a 40 grade can shear into a 30 and a 30 into a 20 but does it happen often with a good diesel rated oil in todays world? No. The Viscosity Index (VI), e.g. the span between the "W" winter grade and the summer, is pretty small on most diesel oils. The wider the span, i.e. 5W40, the more VII are in the oil and the greater chance of shearing. Rotella 15W40 has a pretty narrow span and a 135 VI. The 10W30 is close too with a VI of 142. In the old days the VIIs were pretty fragile and that was one reason why straight grades were often preferred for HD engines because in hard use, the VIIs were used up pretty fast and the oil sheared. Those days are gone. VIIs are much better than they were and on top of that, we have synthetic base oils which have much better viscometric performance and don't need as many VIIs. So you 5W40 or 5W30 syn guys don't need to start yelling. Those oils generally don't shear either.

One downside to running a heavy oil at too low an oil temp is more potential for oil filter bypass. Your filter base has a bypass valve. It's designed to bypass oil if or when the oil filter becomes plugged... but cold or cool thick oil doesn't want to flow thru a filter either. Oil too thick is just like having a plugged filter. Cold starts and those first few miles of operation are when bypass is most likely to occur. When the oil filter bypasses, unfiltered oil is pushed thru the engine. A certain amount of bypassing is inevitable no matter what, but minimizing that with the RIGHT oil viscosity for the temperature is helpful to longevity. The one saving grace of our engines in this regard is the oil cooler. Or oil warmer in winter. It will warm the oil as well as cool it, and when I had my oil temp gauge, I noticed the oil warmed up pretty fast. I have oil temp gauges on some of my other stuff, most notably my '05 F150, and the 6.9L oil warms up faster than the 5.4 even though it holds more oil

I can tell you this, 10W30 has worked great in my truck for many years. Towing, hauling and more dyno time than some of you guys put together. I started there because that's what "the book" said. Later, I validated it by determining my operating oil temps. A good way to think about this is, "As thin as possible, as thick as necessary." Too thin and increased wear or engine damage may result. To thick and you waste energy and power. I can't say 10W30 will work for all of you (I suspect it would work great for most but...) but I KNOW it's worked great for me in the places I've lived. If I lived in a hot climate area, especially if I worked the truck hard, I'd likely use a 15W40. I don't see myself as a "thick oil guy" or a "thin oil guy" I just know enough to pick an oil that's right for my truck in it's normal operational cycle and climate. The oil I choose is based on the circumstances. I say this to avoid the hate that often comes with oil discussions. Sometimes I think it would be easier to discuss ****** dimensions than oil. ( : < )
 

Silver Burner

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Just hanging out around the corner. I've actually been driving the truck the last week instead of the Subaru because I can't get into the 'Ru when it's frozen. The truck doesn't put up much of a fight, and starts right up. Amazing what good plugs, batteries, and a starter can do for ya. I've seen a couple trucks that are SIMILAR to yours, but I just noticed the black canopy on the back. You MAY have driven past my house once. Sometime this summer.

My buddy has that black canopy now on his 89 white F250 diesel. I've got a maroon canopy now that has 2 doors in the back. Tailgate is in the garage now. I should update my avatar... :D
 

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